I have sort of the same question of Mr. Ricci, but I noticed on several
peoples different trees they have Diego Perez De Vivar and Catalina Ponce
De Leon as the Grandparents of our Capitan Diego Romo De Vivar like these
peoples
When I find a lead on familysearch.com that I want to explore further, there is often an LDS tape cited. When I view this it is a parish book with many pages. Is there a way to find the particular page for the record of interest? I used to order the roll from Salt Lake City and spin through it until my record was found.
When you find the date of the record on familysearch.org then you can look
at the start date of the film and go via multiple pages until you get closer
to that date. If you pass it then go a few pages back. Once you done this a
few times it will get easier to jump to the right section of the film. Just
keep track of how many pages you leap forward and how that corresponds to
number of years you've gone forward to.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Research [mailto:research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org] On
> Behalf Of mercado@riverfast.net
> Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2014 4:15 PM
> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> When I find a lead on familysearch.com that I want to explore further,
> there is often an LDS tape cited. When I view this it is a parish book
> with many pages. Is there a way to find the particular page for the
> record of interest? I used to order the roll from Salt Lake City and
> spin through it until my record was found.
>
>
> Thank You, Harry
>
>
>
> Sent from Windows Mail
Mon, 31 Oct 2011 16:04:15
_________________________________
"So he took up his stick again, and tried to thrust the end of the stick _into_ the roll." (c) Terrell wbxmlaa
Thank you, thank you, thank you to Jaime Alvarado. I had been searching various records for that baptismfor some time. How were you able to find it so easily? Very greatful. Thank you also for the input fromeveryone as I continue the search.Deedra Corona
Deedra,
I've experienced several instances where either the indexer made a mistake, or where the priest or the clerk at the parish entered the wrong year. Thus, what I do first is to got to the previous and to the next year (same month and date as indexed). This is what I did in your case, and it worked!
It is helpful when considering any genealogical source to find out, or imagine, how the record was created, and how the information was gathered. Most genealogical records are not court depositions, where the testimony of each informant was rigorously cross-examined for acurracy and validity. Technically, most genealogical evidence is just one step above hear-say.
Consider a christening record, for example. Who was present at the christening? Likely, the mother was not: she may have been at home, secluded, as was sometimes the custom. How well informed were those present concerning the mother's parents? Or of when the baby was actually born? How far was the chapel from the parents' residence? Who made the journey? Or did the priest go to the family? Did he carry the record book with him? Did the priest know the family? Did he make the record himself or did an assistant? Was the record made at the time of the christening or later from memory? Did the priest gather the information amid a lot of conversation and confusion? Was he in a hurry? Did the informants have anything to hide? How many times was the record copied? ...
There are hundreds of such questions. Always consider the circumstances and the times, and imagin the possible variations.
Alice Blake wrote:
>Thanks so much, Stuart. Many things to consider. Being a novice at genealogy, I took for granted that the record entries I was reading were the originals. I've run across all sorts of things, like an entry stating a Sept date placed in the middle of Nov. One of my favorites is the ever helpful, "on the same day, of the same month, of the same year" on page after page! Thanks so much, Alice
>
>--- On Mon, 7/19/10, Stuart Armstrong wrote:
>
>
>From: Stuart Armstrong
>Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
>Date: Monday, July 19, 2010, 6:25 PM
>
>
>>...so the priest most likely made a mistake ...
>
>In studying the records of San José de Gracia, Aguascalientes, I have
>determined that the "original records" are not really original. In
>that parish, for example, there are a great many oodles and gobs of
>mistakes like the ones described in this thread. Because the records
>are hand-written copies from other books or papers. Each month begins
>with the records from Rincón de Romos, and runs from the 1st to the
>31st. Then the records from San José de Gracia - another chapel in
>that parish - are entered, beginnin with the first of the month and
>running in order to the 31st. The only way they could be recorded in
>that order is if they were copied from something else.
>
>In noting the many variations of both given names and surnames, I have
>noticed that the mistakes are typically variations that LOOK alike
>when written, but do not necesarily sound alike - such as Florencia
>and Filomena, and Chávez and Chaires, and yes García and Garza. Even
>though the Cura's handwriting may be clear, the sources that he copied
>from evidently were not.
>
>Other common mistakes:
> Gender indicators inconsistant or simply wrong.
> Name in margin does not agree with name in the body of the record.
> Names of parents and abuelos mixed up.
> Part of a record has some information copied from another
> unrelated record, often from the preceding record.
> Omissions - required information accidentally omitted.
>
>What happens when a priest made a mistake and knew it? In modern
>English we were taught in school to put a line through the mistake and
>then write it correctly. But many priests simply put () parentheses
>around the mistake and continued. If you aren't looking closely you
>might miss that. Also if a person extracting names for the IGI wasn't
>aware of that practice, he or she might put down something that was
>never intended by the original creator of the record.
>
>In other cases, there are variations that do not appear to be
>mistakes. Sometimes a parent's name in a dozen different records will
>be half one way and half another. Problems with inconsistant family
>relationships can sometimes be traced to two siblings who have the
>exact same name. Women, particularly, did not always use the same
>surname, regardless of marital status. I have some who were known by
>as many as seven different surnames.
>
>Not all of the priests were concientious. In the front of each volume
>beginning about 1872 is the following notice:
>
>"Y por cuanto á que es tan frecuente que los Ministros dejan sin
>firmar las partidas de los bautismos que administran, mandó S.S.Y. que
>en lo sucesivo lo hagan en las primeros ocho dias del mes precisamente
>con las del anterior, bajo el concepto que no verificandolo, pagarán
>por cada vez que falten dos pesos á beneficio de la fábrica
>espiritual, sin perjuicio de la responsabilidad de conciencia que
>reportan por no cumplir con ese deber, y á fin de que se tenga siempre
>presente ésta disposición, cuyo cumplimiento será de la
>responsabilidad de los párrocos, se copiarsá la presente cláusula al
>principio de los Libros que se hagan en lo sucesivo, Así S.S.Ylma. lo
>proveyó, mandó, y firmó. - firmado + Pedro - Arzobpo. de Guad.a - una
>rúbrica - Jacinto Lopez - una rúbrica - P. Srio." Es cópia que
>certifica.
>
>Very rough translation:
>
>Inasmuch as it is so frequent that the Ministers do not sign the
>certificates of the Baptisms they (have) administered, it is so
>ordered that, from now on, in the first eight days of the month
>precisely, all of the certificates of the previous month must be
>verified ... or they will be fined two pesos for each failure to
>comply ... and it will be the responsibility of the parish priests
>that this clause shall be copied to the front of every volume ...
>Provided, ordered, and affirmed by the Archbishop of Guadalajara ...
>
>
>
>-- Best regards, Stuart
>mailto:stuartarms@gmail.com
>
Dear Group,
What is the recommended course of action?
I'm accustomed to the regular changes in surname spelling, but recently I've come across the Garza/Garcia situation. I've always considered these surnames to be distinctly different, but I'm not sure that in the past that was always the case.
On one 1715 IGI entry it states the parents as "Juan Garza or Garcia", and Jacinta Minchaca. I've viewed the actual entry and Garcia is clearly entered.
Two years later 1717, another child, same couple, same place, the father's name on the entry is clearly "Juan Garza".
Three years later, 1720, the IGI entry lists the baptismal name as "Pedro Garza or Garcia", and the father as "Juan Garza or Garcia". Why did IGI enter Garza or Garcia if the actual document clearly reads Juan Garza? That's why I'm asking if the names are interchangeable.
How do I handle this? For my records I've entered it both ways, but aren't they two different surnames? And won't that cause problems later? Thanks so much for your expertise and help, Alice
One of my ancestors with the last name marin comes up with one record with her name listed as Martin. None of her ancestors (all lines) for 200 years are Martin so the priest most likely made a mistake when he should have written Marin.
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
Dear Group,
What is the recommended course of action?
I'm accustomed to the regular changes in surname spelling, but recently I've come across the Garza/Garcia situation. I've always considered these surnames to be distinctly different, but I'm not sure that in the past that was always the case.
On one 1715 IGI entry it states the parents as "Juan Garza or Garcia", and Jacinta Minchaca. I've viewed the actual entry and Garcia is clearly entered.
Two years later 1717, another child, same couple, same place, the father's name on the entry is clearly "Juan Garza".
Three years later, 1720, the IGI entry lists the baptismal name as "Pedro Garza or Garcia", and the father as "Juan Garza or Garcia". Why did IGI enter Garza or Garcia if the actual document clearly reads Juan Garza? That's why I'm asking if the names are interchangeable.
How do I handle this? For my records I've entered it both ways, but aren't they two different surnames? And won't that cause problems later? Thanks so much for your expertise and help, Alice
I would just combine the names and put them together, since they were interchangeable.
So put your ancestor as X Garcia Garza or Garza Garcia whatever you feel.
I also have this issues when woman and some men use their maternal name and perfer it,
Ill just put a note on the indivudual and hange their name to the one they used. So in mydatabase
if a Joseph Luna married MAria Gonzalez and their faughter Ana used Garcia after the paternal grandmother
in my database shell be listed as Ana Garcia not Ana Luna. These are always tricky and we have to
be careful with documentation. IThey also help identify ancestry. When men do this it is also very
interesting especially with the Guerra family of Los Altos, a perfect example of Alonso Guerra Valadez
who used his maternal grandfather's name since he had no sons of his own.
Once women have 4 or 5 names they used thats when it gets complicated, cant help you there :)
but I just make quick note of al that
Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> From: mygenes2000@yahoo.com
> Date: Mon, 19 Jul 2010 03:01:29 +0000
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> One of my ancestors with the last name marin comes up with one record with her name listed as Martin. None of her ancestors (all lines) for 200 years are Martin so the priest most likely made a mistake when he should have written Marin.
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Alice Blake
> Sender: research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Date: Sun, 18 Jul 2010 19:03:19
> To:
> Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> Dear Group,
> What is the recommended course of action?
> I'm accustomed to the regular changes in surname spelling, but recently I've come across the Garza/Garcia situation. I've always considered these surnames to be distinctly different, but I'm not sure that in the past that was always the case.
> On one 1715 IGI entry it states the parents as "Juan Garza or Garcia", and Jacinta Minchaca. I've viewed the actual entry and Garcia is clearly entered.
> Two years later 1717, another child, same couple, same place, the father's name on the entry is clearly "Juan Garza".
> Three years later, 1720, the IGI entry lists the baptismal name as "Pedro Garza or Garcia", and the father as "Juan Garza or Garcia". Why did IGI enter Garza or Garcia if the actual document clearly reads Juan Garza? That's why I'm asking if the names are interchangeable.
> How do I handle this? For my records I've entered it both ways, but aren't they two different surnames? And won't that cause problems later? Thanks so much for your expertise and help, Alice
Thanks to all for your input.
What I gather is:
Unlike today, at that point in time in Mexico, the names were interchangeable. I wonder if the same existed at the same time in Spain?
Of course, note both names for my records. And if indeed the names were interchangeable, I should see more of the same. I was just afraid, picking one or the other would lead me on the wrong track.
Thanks again for all your help. Alice
- On Mon, 7/19/10, Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon wrote:
From: Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
To: "Patty Hoyos"
Date: Monday, July 19, 2010, 3:12 AM
I would just combine the names and put them together, since they were interchangeable.
So put your ancestor as X Garcia Garza or Garza Garcia whatever you feel.
I also have this issues when woman and some men use their maternal name and perfer it,
Ill just put a note on the indivudual and hange their name to the one they used. So in mydatabase
if a Joseph Luna married MAria Gonzalez and their faughter Ana used Garcia after the paternal grandmother
in my database shell be listed as Ana Garcia not Ana Luna. These are always tricky and we have to
be careful with documentation. IThey also help identify ancestry. When men do this it is also very
interesting especially with the Guerra family of Los Altos, a perfect example of Alonso Guerra Valadez
who used his maternal grandfather's name since he had no sons of his own.
Once women have 4 or 5 names they used thats when it gets complicated, cant help you there :)
but I just make quick note of al that
Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> From: mygenes2000@yahoo.com
> Date: Mon, 19 Jul 2010 03:01:29 +0000
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> One of my ancestors with the last name marin comes up with one record with her name listed as Martin. None of her ancestors (all lines) for 200 years are Martin so the priest most likely made a mistake when he should have written Marin.
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Alice Blake
> Sender: research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Date: Sun, 18 Jul 2010 19:03:19
> To:
> Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> Dear Group,
> What is the recommended course of action?
> I'm accustomed to the regular changes in surname spelling, but recently I've come across the Garza/Garcia situation. I've always considered these surnames to be distinctly different, but I'm not sure that in the past that was always the case.
> On one 1715 IGI entry it states the parents as "Juan Garza or Garcia", and Jacinta Minchaca. I've viewed the actual entry and Garcia is clearly entered.
> Two years later 1717, another child, same couple, same place, the father's name on the entry is clearly "Juan Garza".
> Three years later, 1720, the IGI entry lists the baptismal name as "Pedro Garza or Garcia", and the father as "Juan Garza or Garcia". Why did IGI enter Garza or Garcia if the actual document clearly reads Juan Garza? That's why I'm asking if the names are interchangeable.
> How do I handle this? For my records I've entered it both ways, but aren't they two different surnames? And won't that cause problems later? Thanks so much for your expertise and help, Alice
It was worse in parts of spain and parts of italy. It was a jewish tradition that the first child used the father's surname and the succeeding children used a grandparents and greatgrandparents in a certain order. If a child died sometimes the order was thrown off. Sometimes the child would change the last name when they came of age. Also the last name changes in some families due to a nickname or they moved from one area to another and the person took the original area where they were from as a last name. Sometimes they had to take a certain last name in order to claim an inheritance. The Salcedos took the maternal grandparents name in order to claim the inheritance and they were obligated to continue the salcedo line. The last name sometimes was the father's first name, grandparent's name, in the case of the Enriquez the name was taken to honor their uncle king enrique II of castilla. Sometimes it was the name of the town or region and other times if your were the count of various areas then sometimes they shortened it and used it as your last name. Sometimes the name is often attached to another name. The Martel were often Known as Perez Martel.
Sometimes a big event in your life changed what you used as your last name.
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
Thanks to all for your input.
What I gather is:
Unlike today, at that point in time in Mexico, the names were interchangeable. I wonder if the same existed at the same time in Spain?
Of course, note both names for my records. And if indeed the names were interchangeable, I should see more of the same. I was just afraid, picking one or the other would lead me on the wrong track.
Thanks again for all your help. Alice
- On Mon, 7/19/10, Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon wrote:
From: Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
To: "Patty Hoyos"
Date: Monday, July 19, 2010, 3:12 AM
I would just combine the names and put them together, since they were interchangeable.
So put your ancestor as X Garcia Garza or Garza Garcia whatever you feel.
I also have this issues when woman and some men use their maternal name and perfer it,
Ill just put a note on the indivudual and hange their name to the one they used. So in mydatabase
if a Joseph Luna married MAria Gonzalez and their faughter Ana used Garcia after the paternal grandmother
in my database shell be listed as Ana Garcia not Ana Luna. These are always tricky and we have to
be careful with documentation. IThey also help identify ancestry. When men do this it is also very
interesting especially with the Guerra family of Los Altos, a perfect example of Alonso Guerra Valadez
who used his maternal grandfather's name since he had no sons of his own.
Once women have 4 or 5 names they used thats when it gets complicated, cant help you there :)
but I just make quick note of al that
Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> From: mygenes2000@yahoo.com
> Date: Mon, 19 Jul 2010 03:01:29 +0000
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> One of my ancestors with the last name marin comes up with one record with her name listed as Martin. None of her ancestors (all lines) for 200 years are Martin so the priest most likely made a mistake when he should have written Marin.
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Alice Blake
> Sender: research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Date: Sun, 18 Jul 2010 19:03:19
> To:
> Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> Dear Group,
> What is the recommended course of action?
> I'm accustomed to the regular changes in surname spelling, but recently I've come across the Garza/Garcia situation. I've always considered these surnames to be distinctly different, but I'm not sure that in the past that was always the case.
> On one 1715 IGI entry it states the parents as "Juan Garza or Garcia", and Jacinta Minchaca. I've viewed the actual entry and Garcia is clearly entered.
> Two years later 1717, another child, same couple, same place, the father's name on the entry is clearly "Juan Garza".
> Three years later, 1720, the IGI entry lists the baptismal name as "Pedro Garza or Garcia", and the father as "Juan Garza or Garcia". Why did IGI enter Garza or Garcia if the actual document clearly reads Juan Garza? That's why I'm asking if the names are interchangeable.
> How do I handle this? For my records I've entered it both ways, but aren't they two different surnames? And won't that cause problems later? Thanks so much for your expertise and help, Alice
"Hi, I'm researching de Mena, Gordoa, Gonzalez and Quiroz. These surnames come
from a triangular ranch area whose points are bordered by Lagos de Moreno
Jalisco on the northwest, Union de San Antonio, Jalisco on the southeast and
Leon, Guanajuato on the east. Specifically I'm mainly interested in my the
parents of Jose Antonio Guillermo de Mena and Maria de Jesus Quezada who were
born in this area about 1750. They had several boys who I know about. I'm
approximating that these two were married about 1772-1782 in Lagos de Moreno,
Jal.
Since many of the Mena clan were raised in Union de San Antonio, Jalisco and
Leon, Guanjuato, I'm speculating that my ancestors might have extended back in
this area first before I look elsewhere toward Guadalajara or Zacatecas between
1600's-1750's and possibly crossing into Spain sometime between 1500's and
1600's.since there was a great migration from Spain in this 150 yrs period.
Thank you in advance.
R Mena
En la imagen de Mucio del Refugio (20 may 1829) Carrillo Suriano aparece como hijo de Encarnacion Carrillo y Germana Suriano nieto de Jose Maria Carrillo y Gertrudis Garcia
tepetongo, zacatecas y de Marcelo y Maria Muñoz https://familysearch.org/s/image/show#uri=https%3A//api.familysearch.or…
estoy tratando de encontrar los abuelos paternos de jose del refugio jauregui
yanez el nacio mas o menos por el 1800 i caso con maria casimira perez el 26 de
nobiembre de 1822 los padres de jose del refugio eran pioquinto jauregui i
dolores yanez cualquer informacion se agradesera
rafael jauregui
________________________________
From: Research on behalf of Challenger LL
Sent: Saturday, April 28, 2018 8:39 AM
To: makas; research; kim tsutsui; jjones; dfitzgerald
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
The book on "Red Road" about the haplogroup, Native Americans - I have made searches for anything that covers these terms for published books and I could not find any leads for such a book. There are at least a half dozen books including "Red Road" in their title that are about Native Americans but I could not tie them to the book that
you are interested in. I believe that you will need to provide more information on the book in order to locate it. Do you remember where you came across the reference to the book?
thank you for checking. this book was in the Nuestros ranchos links under Native American DNA but now when I enter there it puts me back online with titles rather than the book. The author/researcher was female. I was hoping that maybe Arturo would remember it. It had grafs showing the haplo groups A through D and which tribes the females carried these lines in the Northern Hemesphere from Alaska to South America and the islands around there. I was hoping maybe I was the only one who could not access it on Nuestros..
thank you, Linda in Everett
________________________________
From: Rolando Romo
To: "research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org"
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2012 9:17 AM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
The book on "Red Road" about the haplogroup, Native Americans - I have made searches for anything that covers these terms for published books and I could not find any leads for such a book. There are at least a half dozen books including "Red Road" in their title that are about Native Americans but I could not tie them to the book that
you are interested in. I believe that you will need to provide more information on the book in order to locate it. Do you remember where you came across the reference to the book?
Hi, I was wondering if anyone had any information on the Gonzalez Roman family out of Rancho Aguacaliente Municipio de Chimaltitlan Jalisco, Miguel Gonzales and Carmen Roman were residents there. I am searching for a thread to follow that will tell me where the families were from before that.
Mrs. Rosi N Gonzalez
A volunteer in Monterey County CA.
In quietness and confidence shall be my strength. Isiah 30:15
Originally it was a jewish tradition in parts of italy and spain where the first born took the fathers last name then you went down the list on the grandparents and great grandparents last names. There was an order to it. The order sometimes got messed up due to a child's death or the parents changing it for some other reason.
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
I would just combine the names and put them together, since they were interchangeable.
So put your ancestor as X Garcia Garza or Garza Garcia whatever you feel.
I also have this issues when woman and some men use their maternal name and perfer it,
Ill just put a note on the indivudual and hange their name to the one they used. So in mydatabase
if a Joseph Luna married MAria Gonzalez and their faughter Ana used Garcia after the paternal grandmother
in my database shell be listed as Ana Garcia not Ana Luna. These are always tricky and we have to
be careful with documentation. IThey also help identify ancestry. When men do this it is also very
interesting especially with the Guerra family of Los Altos, a perfect example of Alonso Guerra Valadez
who used his maternal grandfather's name since he had no sons of his own.
Once women have 4 or 5 names they used thats when it gets complicated, cant help you there :)
but I just make quick note of al that
Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> From: mygenes2000@yahoo.com
> Date: Mon, 19 Jul 2010 03:01:29 +0000
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> One of my ancestors with the last name marin comes up with one record with her name listed as Martin. None of her ancestors (all lines) for 200 years are Martin so the priest most likely made a mistake when he should have written Marin.
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Alice Blake
> Sender: research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Date: Sun, 18 Jul 2010 19:03:19
> To:
> Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> Dear Group,
> What is the recommended course of action?
> I'm accustomed to the regular changes in surname spelling, but recently I've come across the Garza/Garcia situation. I've always considered these surnames to be distinctly different, but I'm not sure that in the past that was always the case.
> On one 1715 IGI entry it states the parents as "Juan Garza or Garcia", and Jacinta Minchaca. I've viewed the actual entry and Garcia is clearly entered.
> Two years later 1717, another child, same couple, same place, the father's name on the entry is clearly "Juan Garza".
> Three years later, 1720, the IGI entry lists the baptismal name as "Pedro Garza or Garcia", and the father as "Juan Garza or Garcia". Why did IGI enter Garza or Garcia if the actual document clearly reads Juan Garza? That's why I'm asking if the names are interchangeable.
> How do I handle this? For my records I've entered it both ways, but aren't they two different surnames? And won't that cause problems later? Thanks so much for your expertise and help, Alice
In studying the records of San José de Gracia, Aguascalientes, I have
determined that the "original records" are not really original. In
that parish, for example, there are a great many oodles and gobs of
mistakes like the ones described in this thread. Because the records
are hand-written copies from other books or papers. Each month begins
with the records from Rincón de Romos, and runs from the 1st to the
31st. Then the records from San José de Gracia - another chapel in
that parish - are entered, beginnin with the first of the month and
running in order to the 31st. The only way they could be recorded in
that order is if they were copied from something else.
In noting the many variations of both given names and surnames, I have
noticed that the mistakes are typically variations that LOOK alike
when written, but do not necesarily sound alike - such as Florencia
and Filomena, and Chávez and Chaires, and yes García and Garza. Even
though the Cura's handwriting may be clear, the sources that he copied
from evidently were not.
Other common mistakes:
Gender indicators inconsistant or simply wrong.
Name in margin does not agree with name in the body of the record.
Names of parents and abuelos mixed up.
Part of a record has some information copied from another
unrelated record, often from the preceding record.
Omissions - required information accidentally omitted.
What happens when a priest made a mistake and knew it? In modern
English we were taught in school to put a line through the mistake and
then write it correctly. But many priests simply put () parentheses
around the mistake and continued. If you aren't looking closely you
might miss that. Also if a person extracting names for the IGI wasn't
aware of that practice, he or she might put down something that was
never intended by the original creator of the record.
In other cases, there are variations that do not appear to be
mistakes. Sometimes a parent's name in a dozen different records will
be half one way and half another. Problems with inconsistant family
relationships can sometimes be traced to two siblings who have the
exact same name. Women, particularly, did not always use the same
surname, regardless of marital status. I have some who were known by
as many as seven different surnames.
Not all of the priests were concientious. In the front of each volume
beginning about 1872 is the following notice:
"Y por cuanto á que es tan frecuente que los Ministros dejan sin
firmar las partidas de los bautismos que administran, mandó S.S.Y. que
en lo sucesivo lo hagan en las primeros ocho dias del mes precisamente
con las del anterior, bajo el concepto que no verificandolo, pagarán
por cada vez que falten dos pesos á beneficio de la fábrica
espiritual, sin perjuicio de la responsabilidad de conciencia que
reportan por no cumplir con ese deber, y á fin de que se tenga siempre
presente ésta disposición, cuyo cumplimiento será de la
responsabilidad de los párrocos, se copiarsá la presente cláusula al
principio de los Libros que se hagan en lo sucesivo, Así S.S.Ylma. lo
proveyó, mandó, y firmó. - firmado + Pedro - Arzobpo. de Guad.a - una
rúbrica - Jacinto Lopez - una rúbrica - P. Srio." Es cópia que
certifica.
Very rough translation:
Inasmuch as it is so frequent that the Ministers do not sign the
certificates of the Baptisms they (have) administered, it is so
ordered that, from now on, in the first eight days of the month
precisely, all of the certificates of the previous month must be
verified ... or they will be fined two pesos for each failure to
comply ... and it will be the responsibility of the parish priests
that this clause shall be copied to the front of every volume ...
Provided, ordered, and affirmed by the Archbishop of Guadalajara ...
Stuart,
Fantastic synopsis of clerical mistakes made in parishes. I particularly enjoyed the document regarding the fine imposed by the bishop in an attempt to force some careless priests get their act together regarding keeping accurate records. Also, the information you provides teaches us a very important lesson: whenever possible back up your research with multiple sources.
Stuart,
Fantastic synopsis of clerical mistakes made in parishes. I particularly enjoyed the document regarding the fine imposed by the bishop in an attempt to force some careless priests get their act together regarding keeping accurate records. Also, the information you provides teaches us a very important lesson: whenever possible back up your research with multiple sources.
Thanks so much, Stuart. Many things to consider. Being a novice at genealogy, I took for granted that the record entries I was reading were the originals. I've run across all sorts of things, like an entry stating a Sept date placed in the middle of Nov. One of my favorites is the ever helpful, "on the same day, of the same month, of the same year" on page after page! Thanks so much, Alice
--- On Mon, 7/19/10, Stuart Armstrong wrote:
From: Stuart Armstrong
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Date: Monday, July 19, 2010, 6:25 PM
>...so the priest most likely made a mistake ...
In studying the records of San José de Gracia, Aguascalientes, I have
determined that the "original records" are not really original. In
that parish, for example, there are a great many oodles and gobs of
mistakes like the ones described in this thread. Because the records
are hand-written copies from other books or papers. Each month begins
with the records from Rincón de Romos, and runs from the 1st to the
31st. Then the records from San José de Gracia - another chapel in
that parish - are entered, beginnin with the first of the month and
running in order to the 31st. The only way they could be recorded in
that order is if they were copied from something else.
In noting the many variations of both given names and surnames, I have
noticed that the mistakes are typically variations that LOOK alike
when written, but do not necesarily sound alike - such as Florencia
and Filomena, and Chávez and Chaires, and yes García and Garza. Even
though the Cura's handwriting may be clear, the sources that he copied
from evidently were not.
Other common mistakes:
Gender indicators inconsistant or simply wrong.
Name in margin does not agree with name in the body of the record.
Names of parents and abuelos mixed up.
Part of a record has some information copied from another
unrelated record, often from the preceding record.
Omissions - required information accidentally omitted.
What happens when a priest made a mistake and knew it? In modern
English we were taught in school to put a line through the mistake and
then write it correctly. But many priests simply put () parentheses
around the mistake and continued. If you aren't looking closely you
might miss that. Also if a person extracting names for the IGI wasn't
aware of that practice, he or she might put down something that was
never intended by the original creator of the record.
In other cases, there are variations that do not appear to be
mistakes. Sometimes a parent's name in a dozen different records will
be half one way and half another. Problems with inconsistant family
relationships can sometimes be traced to two siblings who have the
exact same name. Women, particularly, did not always use the same
surname, regardless of marital status. I have some who were known by
as many as seven different surnames.
Not all of the priests were concientious. In the front of each volume
beginning about 1872 is the following notice:
"Y por cuanto á que es tan frecuente que los Ministros dejan sin
firmar las partidas de los bautismos que administran, mandó S.S.Y. que
en lo sucesivo lo hagan en las primeros ocho dias del mes precisamente
con las del anterior, bajo el concepto que no verificandolo, pagarán
por cada vez que falten dos pesos á beneficio de la fábrica
espiritual, sin perjuicio de la responsabilidad de conciencia que
reportan por no cumplir con ese deber, y á fin de que se tenga siempre
presente ésta disposición, cuyo cumplimiento será de la
responsabilidad de los párrocos, se copiarsá la presente cláusula al
principio de los Libros que se hagan en lo sucesivo, Así S.S.Ylma. lo
proveyó, mandó, y firmó. - firmado + Pedro - Arzobpo. de Guad.a - una
rúbrica - Jacinto Lopez - una rúbrica - P. Srio." Es cópia que
certifica.
Very rough translation:
Inasmuch as it is so frequent that the Ministers do not sign the
certificates of the Baptisms they (have) administered, it is so
ordered that, from now on, in the first eight days of the month
precisely, all of the certificates of the previous month must be
verified ... or they will be fined two pesos for each failure to
comply ... and it will be the responsibility of the parish priests
that this clause shall be copied to the front of every volume ...
Provided, ordered, and affirmed by the Archbishop of Guadalajara ...
Alice,
The scenario you mention regarding IGI record ambiguity is an important one, and that is why it is important to go to the source. As you explain, the record clearly reads one surname instead of the other, yet the indexer could not make his mind and decided to enter both. Granted, you also have to consider the possibility of priest or the clerk in the parish making a mistake. I've have found many obvious errors in marriage and baptismal records, sometimes the error is repeating the entering the name of another person listed in the same date in the same book. It would appear as if the clerk was in a hurry, and forgot the names of the persons, and made a simple clerical error.
> Joseph, my name is Kenneth Tejeda, and I am very interested in researching the Tejeda name as our roots are from Jalisco, Mexico. I currently live in Agoura, California and have been trying to trace our family name for many years. My grandfather was born in Michocanejo, Jalisco in the early 1900's. His name was Jesus Tejeda, and his father(Toribio) and Grandfather (Juan) were also born in Teocaltiche / Michoacanejo. I visited Michoacanejo in 1980, and stayed with Teresa Delgadillo for 2-3 days. I had a chance to speak briefly with Ignacio (?) Tejeda while I was there. Unfortunately, I did not get a chance to go down to the church (Nuestra Senora de Los Dolores) in Teocaltiche during my visit to further research our family name. Que lastima!! My great aunt, Delores Tejeda, who was also born in Michoacanejo (she was the younger sister of my grandfather Jesus) helped set up my trip down to Jalisco in 1980.
I look forward to researching the Tejeda name and Roots in the Teocaltiche / Michoacanejo area of Jalisco. I assume many of the records would be in Teocaltiche at the famous Iglesia - Nuesta Senora de Los Delores - Our trail leads to Juan Tejeda, father of Toribio Tejeda, who lived in Michoacanejo. Juan, is the Great grandfather of my father, Rennie Tejeda. We seem to have questions / be stuck regarding the birth of Juan Tejeda as to when and where.
Welcome Ken,m I also have Tejedas from Teocaltiche-Ojuelos area but in the1700s, would be neat if were related.
Daniel
> From: kklne@sbcglobal.net
> Date: Sun, 16 May 2010 20:06:53 -0700
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
>> Joseph, my name is Kenneth Tejeda, and I am very interested in researching the Tejeda name as our roots are from Jalisco, Mexico. I currently live in Agoura, California and have been trying to trace our family name for many years. My grandfather was born in Michocanejo, Jalisco in the early 1900's. His name was Jesus Tejeda, and his father(Toribio) and Grandfather (Juan) were also born in Teocaltiche / Michoacanejo. I visited Michoacanejo in 1980, and stayed with Teresa Delgadillo for 2-3 days. I had a chance to speak briefly with Ignacio (?) Tejeda while I was there. Unfortunately, I did not get a chance to go down to the church (Nuestra Senora de Los Dolores) in Teocaltiche during my visit to further research our family name. Que lastima!! My great aunt, Delores Tejeda, who was also born in Michoacanejo (she was the younger sister of my grandfather Jesus) helped set up my trip down to Jalisco in 1980.
>
> I look forward to researching the Tejeda name and Roots in the Teocaltiche / Michoacanejo area of Jalisco. I assume many of the records would be in Teocaltiche at the famous Iglesia - Nuesta Senora de Los Delores - Our trail leads to Juan Tejeda, father of Toribio Tejeda, who lived in Michoacanejo. Juan, is the Great grandfather of my father, Rennie Tejeda. We seem to have questions / be stuck regarding the birth of Juan Tejeda as to when and where.
>
> Muchas Gracias,
>
> Senor Ken Tejeda
>>
Like Daniel, my tejeda is from teocaltiche and in the 1700's. She travels to jalos and leaves family there.
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: KEN TEJEDA
Date: Sun, 16 May 2010 20:06:53
To:
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
> Joseph, my name is Kenneth Tejeda, and I am very interested in researching the Tejeda name as our roots are from Jalisco, Mexico. I currently live in Agoura, California and have been trying to trace our family name for many years. My grandfather was born in Michocanejo, Jalisco in the early 1900's. His name was Jesus Tejeda, and his father(Toribio) and Grandfather (Juan) were also born in Teocaltiche / Michoacanejo. I visited Michoacanejo in 1980, and stayed with Teresa Delgadillo for 2-3 days. I had a chance to speak briefly with Ignacio (?) Tejeda while I was there. Unfortunately, I did not get a chance to go down to the church (Nuestra Senora de Los Dolores) in Teocaltiche during my visit to further research our family name. Que lastima!! My great aunt, Delores Tejeda, who was also born in Michoacanejo (she was the younger sister of my grandfather Jesus) helped set up my trip down to Jalisco in 1980.
I look forward to researching the Tejeda name and Roots in the Teocaltiche / Michoacanejo area of Jalisco. I assume many of the records would be in Teocaltiche at the famous Iglesia - Nuesta Senora de Los Delores - Our trail leads to Juan Tejeda, father of Toribio Tejeda, who lived in Michoacanejo. Juan, is the Great grandfather of my father, Rennie Tejeda. We seem to have questions / be stuck regarding the birth of Juan Tejeda as to when and where.
Nos venimos a vivir a Utah porque mi esposo y yo veniamos de vacaciones , y nos gustaba la tranquilidad de este lugar, despues nuestras hijas crecieron y ya no queriamos que ellas siguieran en California porque pensamos que este era un buen lugar para que ellas crecieran venian de 10,8, y un anio. asi que ahora tienen 16, 14, y 8 y este lugar es muy pacifico la gente aqui es buena ( bueno aunque hay de todo) pero nuestros vecinos son buenos y amables. a mi siempre me gusto estar en contacto con la naturaleza, asi que en este lugar tu puedes ver las montanas , el cielo azul, la nieve cuando es temporada, puedes ver venados, vacas, caballos, gallinas , aveztruces , patos, borregos, y asi toda clase de animales, y tambien mi esposo se va a pescar a un rio que esta muy cerquita de la casa. asi que por eso me gusta este lugar, y porque mis hijas crecieron y espero que asi
sigan de una manera muy sana.
yo soy de Mexico, naci en Guadalajara jalisco, mis antepasados son de tepatitlan jalisco, Acatic, Colima y Cd. Guzman
y bueno en realidad tu vives muy cerquita de donde viviamos nosotros.
Nos venimos a vivir a Utah porque mi esposo y yo veniamos de vacaciones , y nos gustaba la tranquilidad de este lugar, despues nuestras hijas crecieron y ya no queriamos que ellas siguieran en California porque pensamos que este era un buen lugar para que ellas crecieran venian de 10,8, y un anio. asi que ahora tienen 16, 14, y 8 y este lugar es muy pacifico la gente aqui es buena ( bueno aunque hay de todo) pero nuestros vecinos son buenos y amables. a mi siempre me gusto estar en contacto con la naturaleza, asi que en este lugar tu puedes ver las montanas , el cielo azul, la nieve cuando es temporada, puedes ver venados, vacas, caballos, gallinas , aveztruces , patos, borregos, y asi toda clase de animales, y tambien mi esposo se va a pescar a un rio que esta muy cerquita de la casa. asi que por eso me gusta este lugar, y porque mis hijas crecieron y espero que asi
sigan de una manera muy sana.
yo soy de Mexico, naci en Guadalajara jalisco, mis antepasados son de tepatitlan jalisco, Acatic, Colima y Cd. Guzman
y bueno en realidad tu vives muy cerquita de donde viviamos nosotros.
El Cerro de la Campana es el que divide Mezcala de Acatic. Del rancho de mi papá se ve Mezcala pues está en las faldas del Cerro de la Campana.
Mis padres y abuelos son de Tepatitlán, así como mis bisabuelos excepto Ruperto Díaz de Luna del rancho La Vaquería de Jalostotitlán. La mayoría de mis ancestros están entre Tepatitlán, Jalostotitlán, San Miguel el Alto, San Juan de los Lagos, y años mas atrás de Lagos de Moreno, Aguascalientes, Ayo el Chico, Nochistlán, Michoacán y Durango.
Por Parte de mi mama toda su familia materna es de Acatic Jalisco y paterna es de Tepatitlan . y si , ya me hize mormona hace como 16 anos. cuando vivia en California.
Saludos.
Martha Gomez
----- Original Message -----
From: "Juan Ramón Alvarez"
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 3:24:21 PM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
Gracias María
Oye pues tenemos algo en común, yo soy de Mezcala municipio de Tepatitlán. Solo un cerro divide a Mezcala de Acatic.
Que bonito que disfrutes la naturaleza como dices que lo hacen en Utah.
Nos venimos a vivir a Utah porque mi esposo y yo veniamos de vacaciones , y nos gustaba la tranquilidad de este lugar, despues nuestras hijas crecieron y ya no queriamos que ellas siguieran en California porque pensamos que este era un buen lugar para que ellas crecieran venian de 10,8, y un anio. asi que ahora tienen 16, 14, y 8 y este lugar es muy pacifico la gente aqui es buena ( bueno aunque hay de todo) pero nuestros vecinos son buenos y amables. a mi siempre me gusto estar en contacto con la naturaleza, asi que en este lugar tu puedes ver las montanas , el cielo azul, la nieve cuando es temporada, puedes ver venados, vacas, caballos, gallinas , aveztruces , patos, borregos, y asi toda clase de animales, y tambien mi esposo se va a pescar a un rio que esta muy cerquita de la casa. asi que por eso me gusta este lugar, y porque mis hijas crecieron y espero que asi
sigan de una manera muy sana.
yo soy de Mexico, naci en Guadalajara jalisco, mis antepasados son de tepatitlan jalisco, Acatic, Colima y Cd. Guzman
y bueno en realidad tu vives muy cerquita de donde viviamos nosotros.
I would suggest, trying trying the FamilySearch Record Search page (pilot). I have been able to piece together Family tree on both sides of your family.
Fourth Generation
8. Manuel Resendez was born in 1864 in Zacatecas, Mexico. He died on 17 Jun 1920 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. He was buried on 18 Jun 1920. Manuel married Piedad Nunez.
9. Piedad Nunez was born on 23 Aug 1880 in Mexico. She died on 5 Sep 1965 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 8 Sep 1965 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA.
They had the following children.
M i. Manuel Resendez was born in 1897.
M ii. Francisco Resendez was born in 1899.
M iii. Jesus Resendez was born in 1903.
M iv. Antonio Resendez was born on 26 Nov 1905. He died on 22 Apr 1970 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. He was buried on 24 Apr 1970 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA.
M v. Salvador Resendez was born in 1908.
M vi. Juan Bautista Resendez was born on 7 Nov 1911 in Zacatecas, Mexico. He died on 30 Aug 1912 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. He was buried on 31 Aug 1912.
+ 4 M vii. Raymundo Resendez was born on 24 Aug 1912. He died on 16 Dec 1942.
F viii. Mary Resendez was born in 1915.
10. Guillermo Cordova was born on 10 Feb 1884 in Mexico. He died on 31 Jan 1952 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. He was buried on 1 Feb 1952 in El Paso, Texas, USA. Guillermo married Delfina Aguilar.
11. Delfina Aguilar was born on 24 Dec 1889 in Chihuahua, Mexico. She died on 5 Dec 1972 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 7 Dec 1972 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA.
They had the following children.
M i. Lorenzo Cordova was born about 1907.
F ii. Midra Cordova was born on 15 May 1911 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She died on 7 Apr 1913 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 7 Apr 1913.
+ 5 F iii. Manuela Cordova was born on 10 Jun 1913. She died on 24 Nov 1948.
F iv. Flora Cordova was born on 22 Mar 1915 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She died on 17 Aug 1962 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 20 Aug 1962 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA.
M v. Guillermo Cordova was born about 1917.
F vi. Ignacia Cordova was born on 31 Jul 1919 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She died on 25 Apr 1958 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 28 Apr 1958 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA.
M vii. Santiago Cordova was born about 1921.
M viii. Juan Cordova was born about 1924.
F ix. Juanita Cordova was born on 12 Mar 1928 in El Paso, Texas, USA.
12. Ancelmo Guerrero was born in Chihuahua, Mexico. He died in 1906 in El Paso, Texas. Ancelmo married Paula Martinez Ibarra.
13. Paula Martinez Ibarra was born on 29 Jun 1844 in Mexico. She was christened in Sonora, Mexico. She died on 9 Aug 1930 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 11 Aug 1930.
They had the following children.
M i. Donaciano Guerrero was born on 24 May 1887 in Jimenez, Chihuahua, Mexico. He died on 10 Oct 1943 in Cochise, Arizona, United States.
F ii. Casimiro Guerrero was born in about 1891 in Mexico.
F iii. Altagracia ( Twin ) Guerrero was born on 3 Apr 1893 in Chihuahua, Mexico.
M iv. Benito Guerrero was born on 3 Apr 1893 in Chihuahua, Mexico. He died on 22 Jan 1962 in Silver City, Grant, New Mexico, United States.
M v. Anselmo II Guerrero was born on 4 Jun 1899 in Hidalgo del Parral, Chihuahua, Mexico. He died on 14 Oct 1993 in Odessa, Ector, Texas, United States.
+ 6 M vi. Luz J Guerrero was born on 4 Jan 1900. He died on 21 Nov 1973.
14. Juan Castanon. Juan married Concepcion Orosco.
15. Concepcion Orosco.
They had the following children.
+ 7 F i. Engracia Castanon was born on 16 Apr 1910. She died on 4 Oct 1950.
Fifth Generation
16. Jose Maria Resendez was born in Zacatecas, Zacatecas, Mexico. Jose married Maria de los Angeles Resendez.
17. Maria de los Angeles Resendez was born in Zacatecas, Mexico.
They had the following children.
+ 8 M i. Manuel Resendez was born in 1864. He died on 17 Jun 1920.
M ii. Agustin Resendez.
19. Exequia Nunez.
She had the following children.
+ 9 F i. Piedad Nunez was born on 23 Aug 1880. She died on 5 Sep 1965.
20. Manuel Cordova Apodaca. Manuel married Petra Lopez.
21. Petra Lopez was born on 5 May 1873 in Mexico. She died on 1 May 1928 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 2 May 1928.
They had the following children.
F i. Mra Eulalia de la Luz Cordova was christened on 28 Dec 1869 in Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
M ii. Estanislado Miguel De Jesus Cordova Lopes was christened on 12 May 1874 in Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
M iii. Manuela Cordova Lopez was born in 1879 in Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico. He died on 20 Feb 1927 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. He was buried on 22 Feb 1927.
F iv. ... Maria ... Cordova was christened in Feb 1880 in Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
+ 10 M v. Guillermo Cordova was born on 10 Feb 1884. He died on 31 Jan 1952.
F vi. Maria del Refugio Cordova was christened on 8 Apr 1888 in Chihuahua, Chihuahua, Mexico.
F vii. Maria Juana Cordova was christened on 11 Mar 1893 in Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
22. Jose Inez Aguilar. Jose married Zenono Gutierrez.
23. Zenono Gutierrez.
They had the following children.
M i. Juan Aguilar was born on 24 Jun 1886 in Jimenez, Chihuahua, Mexico. He died on 17 Jul 1913 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. He was buried on 17 Jul 1913.
+ 11 F ii. Delfina Aguilar was born on 24 Dec 1889. She died on 5 Dec 1972.
26. Julia Martinez was born in Mexico. Julia married Dionicia Ybarra.
27. Dionicia Ybarra was born in Mexico.
They had the following children.
+ 13 F i. Paula Martinez Ibarra was born on 29 Jun 1844. She died on 9 Aug 1930.
28. Pedro Castanon. Pedro married Maria Franco.
29. Maria Franco was born on 15 Aug 1874 in Mexico. She died on 16 Oct 1951 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 18 Oct 1951 in El Paso, Texas, USA.
They had the following children.
+ 14 M i. Juan Castanon.
F ii. Pabla Castanon was born on 25 Jan 1888 in Mexico. She died on 27 Feb 1976 in El Paso, Texas, USA.
Sixth Generation
40. Jose Miguel Gregorio Cordoba Garsia was christened on 9 May 1808 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico. Jose married Ma. Ynosencia Apodaca Guebara on 27 Feb 1832 in Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
41. Ma. Ynosencia Apodaca Guebara was christened on 29 Dec 1809 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
They had the following children.
+ 20 M i. Manuel Cordova Apodaca.
F ii. Mra . Gertrudis Refugio Cordova Apodaca was christened on 16 Nov 1840 in Nuestra Señora de Guadalupe, Juárez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
F iii. Maria Teofila Nicanora Cordoba Apodaca was christened on 10 Jan 1843 in Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
42. Miguel Lopez. Miguel married Maria Cordova.
43. Maria Cordova.
They had the following children.
+ 21 F i. Petra Lopez was born on 5 May 1873. She died on 1 May 1928.
58. Seferino Franco. Seferino married Seferina Ortiz.
59. Seferina Ortiz.
They had the following children.
+ 29 F i. Maria Franco was born on 15 Aug 1874. She died on 16 Oct 1951.
Seventh Generation
80. Jose Maria Cordoba. Jose married Maria Josefa Garcia de Noriega on 14 Jun 1802 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
81. Maria Josefa Garcia de Noriega.
They had the following children.
F i. Maria Josefa Guadalupe Cordoba Garcia was christened on 25 Mar 1803 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
F ii. Maria Josefa Yanuaria Cordoba Garcia was christened on 20 Sep 1804 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
M iii. Jose de Jesus Benigno Cordova Garsia was christened on 14 Feb 1806 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
+ 40 M iv. Jose Miguel Gregorio Cordoba Garsia was christened on 9 May 1808.
F v. Ma. Franca. Tomasa Cordoba Garsia was christened on 18 Sep 1809 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
F vi. Ma. Trenidad Josefa de La Cruz Cordoba Garcia was christened on 15 Sep 1810 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
F vii. Ma. Guadalupe Josefa Cordoba Garcia was christened on 3 Feb 1812 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
82. Ramon Ynocencio Apodaca. Ramon married Maria Guadalupe Nino Ladron de Guevara on 6 Nov 1804 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
83. Maria Guadalupe Nino Ladron de Guevara.
They had the following children.
F i. Josefa Gorgoria Apodaca Guevara was christened on 12 Sep 1805 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
M ii. Jose Rosalio Apodaca Guebara was christened on 3 Sep 1807 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
+ 41 F iii. Ma. Ynosencia Apodaca Guebara was christened on 29 Dec 1809.
M iv. Jose Antonio Marcelo Apodaca Guebara was christened on 21 Feb 1812 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
M v. Jose Onofre Basilio Apodaca Guebara was christened on 26 Jun 1815 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
M vi. Jose Ramon Apodaca Guevara was christened in Mar 1820 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
M vii. Jose Julian Apodaca Guevara was christened on 14 Feb 1823 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
I would like to know if anyone has any information regarding el RANCHO EL PAPELOTE IN JALISCO. My grandmother was from there. I don't know if that would belong to San Julian Jalisco or San Juan de Los Lagos Jalisco. My grandmother Camila Estrada was from that area. I can't seem to find anything on the web regarding this rancheria. Can anyone help?
"Rancho de la Municipalidad de San Juan de los Lagos, segundo canton,
estado de Jalisco. Otro de la municipalidad de Union."
joseph
Nelida1962 wrote:
>I would like to know if anyone has any information regarding el RANCHO EL PAPELOTE IN JALISCO. My grandmother was from there. I don't know if that would belong to San Julian Jalisco or San Juan de Los Lagos Jalisco. My grandmother Camila Estrada was from that area. I can't seem to find anything on the web regarding this rancheria. Can anyone help?
>
>Gracias,
>Nelida Vazquez Estrada
Gracias Mr. Puentes for all your information. You have answered my question. That EL PAPELOTE belongs to San Juan de Los Lagos Jalisco not San Julian.
Muchas Gracias,
Nelida Vazquez Estrada
"Rancho de la Municipalidad de San Juan de los Lagos, segundo canton,
estado de Jalisco. Otro de la municipalidad de Union."
joseph
Nelida1962 wrote:
>I would like to know if anyone has any information regarding el RANCHO EL PAPELOTE IN JALISCO. My grandmother was from there. I don't know if that would belong to San Julian Jalisco or San Juan de Los Lagos Jalisco. My grandmother Camila Estrada was from that area. I can't seem to find anything on the web regarding this rancheria. Can anyone help?
>
>Gracias,
>Nelida Vazquez Estrada
Hello, My name is George Godoy, My ancestors were from Tlaltenango,Zacatecas and Tepechiltan, Zacatecas. This is my Linage Franco Godoy m. Rosamaria de Llamas, Agustine Godoy m. Maria Anttonia De La O, Casimiro Celedonio m. Ana de luna,Mathiana ynigues,and Petra Correa, Jose Crecencio Godoy m. Maria Lugarda Nava,Leocadia Cobarrubias. Jose Epitacio Godoy m.Josefa Marquez, Cristobal Godoy m. Maria Jesus Herrera, Catarina Godoy, Dorotea Sanchez. Juan Nepamuceno Godoy m. Petra Martinez,Florentina Agredano in Tepic,Nayarit.My Father Albino Godoy m. Maria Jesus Urias Monreal a Decendant of Presido of Tucson Arizona settlers.
You and I are primos. I am a direct descendant of Francisco Godoy, Maria de la Rosa Llamas and their son Agustin Godoy. I lose your lineage there. Are you saying that Agustin and Maria Antonia de la O had a son named Casimiro Celedonio? I did not have him as one of their children.
I have a suspsicion that Francisco Godoy is a descendant of Juan Carlos de Godoy, whose descendancy Susana Leniski has documented quite well (you can find it in her member's genealogy folder), but I have not been able to make the connection as I cannot find the marriage document or birth document for Francisco de Godoy.
Welcome to the group. There is a whole group of us with lines in Tlaltenango and Tepechitlan and I am sure we are all related.
Hello, I would like to introduce myself. My name is George Godoy I been researching the Godoys/Godoi of Zacatecas so far I'm down to my nineth Gen. GreatGrandfather Nicolas Godoy his son Franco married Maria Rosa de LLamas in 1704, the family settle in Rancho de la LLamas in Tlaltenango,Zacatecas they are listed in the Census of Tlaltenango of 1754.
George
Do you have an Agustina in your de Llamas tree? Marge:)
On Nov 3, 2006, at 6:29 PM, godoi1m@netzero.net wrote:
> Hello, I would like to introduce myself. My name is George Godoy I
> been researching the Godoys/Godoi of Zacatecas so far I'm down to my
> nineth Gen. GreatGrandfather Nicolas Godoy his son Franco married
> Maria Rosa de LLamas in 1704, the family settle in Rancho de la LLamas
> in Tlaltenango,Zacatecas they are listed in the Census of Tlaltenango
> of 1754.
>
> George
George, I emailed you my genealogical report for my Godoy/Llamas line....is there a connection there? I haven't researched this line past 1746...my Godoy/Llamas are, too, in Tlaltenango de Sanchez Roman, in Zacatecas. I go up as far as Josseph Godoy married to Maria Magdalena de Llamas who had Maria Salvadora Godoy in 1756 and Maria Rita Godoy in 1746. Maria Salvadora married Francisco Salvador Bergara and that's the last of the line because the rest of my family branches out to Bergara's and then to Avila's and then to Correa's......let me know!
George, I emailed you my genealogical report for my Godoy/Llamas line....is there a connection there? I haven't researched this line past 1746...my Godoy/Llamas are, too, in Tlaltenango de Sanchez Roman, in Zacatecas. I go up as far as Josseph Godoy married to Maria Magdalena de Llamas who had Maria Salvadora Godoy in 1756 and Maria Rita Godoy in 1746. Maria Salvadora married Francisco Salvador Bergara and that's the last of the line because the rest of my family branches out to Bergara's and then to Avila's and then to Correa's......let me know!
Hello,
My Name is Denise Lovato-Duran I am researching the Lobato's who are from Sombrete, Zacatacas. I recently had my brother do his DNA and we turned out Halogroup Q-3 it also matched a Tafoya whose roots go back to Michoacan. I think my Indian ancestor came to Sombrete and was baptized a Lobato. The first Lobato's that came to New Mexico were Bartolome Lobato and his brother Matias I am possibly the descentant of Matias Lobato.
Thank You
Denise Lovato-Duran
----- Original Message -----
From: DENISE LOVATO-DURAN
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 7:52 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
Hello,
My Name is Denise Lovato-Duran I am researching the Lobato's who are from Sombrete, Zacatacas. I recently had my brother do his DNA and we turned out Halogroup Q-3 it also matched a Tafoya whose roots go back to Michoacan. I think my Indian ancestor came to Sombrete and was baptized a Lobato. The first Lobato's that came to New Mexico were Bartolome Lobato and his brother Matias I am possibly the descentant of Matias Lobato.
Thank You
Denise Lovato-Duran
Soy nuevo en este grupo y estoy interesado en genealogía principalmente de
Zacatecas. Mis abuelos paternos y la mayor parte de mis ancestros provienen
de Jerez, con ramas que vienen de Monte Escobedo, Tlaltenango, Fresnillo,
Colotlán, etc.
Cuento con bastante información sobre familias de Jerez y me pongo a su
disposición.
Mis ancestros eran Felix de Arellano y Felix de Tinajero de Tepetongo y Salitrillo. Mis ancestros de apellido Olague eran de Jerez y Tepetongo. Tambien tengo Suriano, Quijas, Lucio, Escovedo, Aro, Flores, Munoz, Campos, Salazar, Miranda. Puedes ver mi arbol genealogico en este website.
Emilie Garcia
Port Orchard, WA --
----- Original Message -----
From: Hector Felix Aizcorbe
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Sunday, March 04, 2007 8:34 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
Hola a todos:
Soy nuevo en este grupo y estoy interesado en genealogía principalmente de
Zacatecas. Mis abuelos paternos y la mayor parte de mis ancestros provienen
de Jerez, con ramas que vienen de Monte Escobedo, Tlaltenango, Fresnillo,
Colotlán, etc.
Cuento con bastante información sobre familias de Jerez y me pongo a su
disposición.
Perdón por una respuesta tan tardía, pero he estado en cambio de trabajo muy
ocupado. Yo tengo entre mis ancestros muchos de los apellidos que mencionas,
y, en algunos casos, he avanzado mucho. Mi árbil genealógico lo tengo armado
en hojas de Excel, ya que a mi me facilita mas la consulta. Si te interesa
te lo puedo enviar, tengo un file por mi abuelo paterno y otro por mi abuela
paterna. Hoy he visitado el tuyo, pero a pesar de que muchos apellidos
coinciden, hasta ahora no aparece ninguno de mis ancestros.
Saludos y quedo a tus órdenes,
Héctor
>From: "Emilie Garcia"
>Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
>To:
>Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2007 04:01:57 -0800
>
>Bienvenido, Hector,
>
>Mis ancestros eran Felix de Arellano y Felix de Tinajero de Tepetongo y
>Salitrillo. Mis ancestros de apellido Olague eran de Jerez y Tepetongo.
>Tambien tengo Suriano, Quijas, Lucio, Escovedo, Aro, Flores, Munoz, Campos,
>Salazar, Miranda. Puedes ver mi arbol genealogico en este website.
>
>Emilie Garcia
>Port Orchard, WA --
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Hector Felix Aizcorbe
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Sent: Sunday, March 04, 2007 8:34 PM
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
>
> Hola a todos:
>
> Soy nuevo en este grupo y estoy interesado en genealogía principalmente
>de
> Zacatecas. Mis abuelos paternos y la mayor parte de mis ancestros
>provienen
> de Jerez, con ramas que vienen de Monte Escobedo, Tlaltenango,
>Fresnillo,
> Colotlán, etc.
>
> Cuento con bastante información sobre familias de Jerez y me pongo a su
> disposición.
>
> Saludos,
> Héctor Félix Aizcorbe
>
>
> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
>
> To post, send email to:
> research(at)nuestrosranchos.org
>
> To change your subscription, log on to:
> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
This is the only info that I have on my family in AGUASCALIENTES:
FRANCISCA RODRIGUEZ b 10/4/1880 in LA DURNAMILLA, AGUASCALIENTES, MX
father: JOSE RODRIGUZ
mother: APOLONIA SERNA
spouse(1): VIDAL SERNA
spouse (2): MARTIN (MARTINIANO) SERNA
children of VIDAL SERNA and FRANCISCA RODRIGUEZ:
MARCOS RODRIGUEZ SERNA b abt 1902 in CALVILLO, AGUASCALIENTES, MX d DELANO,
KERN, CALIFORNIA, USA
JUAN RODRIGUEZ SERNA b abt 1901 in CALVILLO, AGUASCALIENTES, MX
ROSENDO RODRIGUEZ SERNA b abt 1904 in CALVILLO, AGUASCALIENTES, MX d abt 1953
in CUTLER, TULARE, CALIFORNIA, USA
CASIMIRO RODRIGUEZ SERNA: b 3/4/1909 in CALVILLO, AGUASCALIENTES, MX d
2/15/2002 in CUTLER, TULARE, CALIFORNIA, USA This is my grandfather
Good Evening Group, I have the opportunity to join friends on a trip to Aguascalientes and Zacatecas this Semana Santa. In my efforts to locate information on my mother, Enedina Onate's family, I've been through several LDS films following leads with no success. It appears that most of my oral history evades documentation. The only fact I have to work from is that my great-grandfather, Rosalio Onate, originally from Villa Garcia, Zac.(based on border crossing records) is entombed in an Aguascalientes, Agua. church. At 13, I was taken to see it, but at the time I wasn't interested and don't know the name of the church! I'd like to take this is my opportunity to find information on Rosalio and immediate family from the church. I've checked film 0299882 Aguascalientes deaths from 1918-1961 with no luck. How do you suggest I narrow down the possibilities and locate the church? I would like to arrive with some information to go on as my time will be limited. Any help on researching in Mexico and visiting in general would be greatly appreciated. Thanks so much, Alice BB
From: arturoramos
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Lopez and Viramontes in Jalpa Zacatecas
Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 09:10:13 -0800 (PST)
Veronica:
Welcome to the group. I am sure you will find plenty of people here willing to help.
As far as Jalpa records, you are correct in that they are skimpy. There appears to have been loss of most of the records probably in a war or a fire. If you do a search on the site, there are members who have been able to research genealogy and microhistory nevertheless.
I think given the approximate dates of the ancestors for whom you have details, you should be able to find some records. Jalpa does not appear to be indexed (given the late years and paucity of the records). So that means you will basically have to look through the films.
Your great-grandparents appear to have been born around 1880 and probably married around 1900 so their baptisms might not be in the church records, but your grandparents likely are. Many baptism records post-1820 or so and nearly all civil registry records include grandparents' names so your grandparents' baptisms/birth registry will list your great-grandparents and great-great grandparents' names.
Also your great grandparents' marriage records are likely in the informacion matrimonial films from Jalpa and those will likewise list your great-great-grandparents' names. In fact, because the informacion matrimonial goes back to 1864, you should be able to find even your great-great-grandparents' marriages from which you can get their parents' names. Then there is a 36 year gap which you may or may not be able to overcome but you can cross that bridge when you get to it... seems like you have plenty to work with for now.
When you are there check the phone book, look for Oñate and make phone calls regarding your ggrandpa, identify yourself inmediatly and than make your request clearly, cause of phone calls that bad people make asking for monetary help, nowadays people hesitate to give up info, so one better give up info first. Look for anyone with similar names such any Rosalio, as it is usual to name children arter relatives. Look in the surrounding towns phone books also, make a list first so you can carry it back in case time is not enough. That is an idea, good luck. Maybe a name will ring off the memory afterwards.
Do you have and old relative close? Talk about your trip, comment about names and related places. Maybe it will ring the bell.
---------------------------------
¡Capacidad ilimitada de almacenamiento en tu correo!
No te preocupes más por el espacio de tu cuenta con Correo Yahoo!: http://correo.yahoo.com.mx/
Hi Daniel, Were you able to locate and access the capital city of Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes through the website you sent for 1930 Mexico census? The folks at my FHC couldn't locate through that site. It sure would help if I knew that someone could locate and access it. Thanks, Alice BB
My name is Cindy Gutierrez and I am researching my father Antonio's family. He was born in Jalisco in a small town called Acatic. He was born on his father's Rancho El Sauz. The family names I am researching are Gutierrez(my grandmother Josephinas family name) and De La Torre (my grandfather Antonios family name). Included are De Moron, Becerra, and a few others that I am still trying to get. My Grandmothers family had a Rancho near Tepa, I think, my dad is kind of fuzzy on some things, but I will get all the information I can. Most of my fathers family is here now, although they live part of the year in Acatic. I have been to Mexico many times to see family and take pictures of the Rancho before they sold it. I would love to know more about my family and possibly connect with cousins here in California and elsewhere. Unfortunately I no longer am able to speak Spanish so that has limited my ability to get information. I am very by the possibilites of
this website.
Hi Cindy I have some Gutierrez and De la Torre in my family too. I guess info posted on these surnames will be usful for both of us. I submited a small file, please seeif you can access it, it may be useful for you.
Gabriela> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 03:25:42 -0700> From: cjg63@sbcglobal.net> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)> > Hello Everyone,> > My name is Cindy Gutierrez and I am researching my father Antonio's family. He was born in Jalisco in a small town called Acatic. He was born on his father's Rancho El Sauz. The family names I am researching are Gutierrez(my grandmother Josephinas family name) and De La Torre (my grandfather Antonios family name). Included are De Moron, Becerra, and a few others that I am still trying to get. My Grandmothers family had a Rancho near Tepa, I think, my dad is kind of fuzzy on some things, but I will get all the information I can. Most of my fathers family is here now, although they live part of the year in Acatic. I have been to Mexico many times to see family and take pictures of the Rancho before they sold it. I would love to know more about my family and possibly connect with cousins here in California an
d elsewhere. Unfortunately I no longer am able to speak Spanish so that has limited my ability to get information. I am very by the possibilites of> this website. > > Cindy Gutierrez> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List> > To post, send email to:> research(at)nuestrosranchos.org> > To change your subscription, log on to:> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
_________________________________________________________________
More immediate than e-mail? Get instant access with Windows Live Messenger. http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Re…
Hola Ladies ,I too have Gutierrez and de La Torre lines. The Gutierrez line hangs out in the region of Los Altos -Jalostotitlan,San Miguel el Alto and San Julian . Jalos lies near Tepatitlan. I have an ancestor Clemente de La Torre Ledesma (which are two names put together some time back) was from Tepatitlan and his offspring which some stayed with de La Torre.
Ronnie Reynoso > From: gsoa@hotmail.com> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 11:30:21 -0500> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)> > > Hi Cindy I have some Gutierrez and De la Torre in my family too. I guess info posted on these surnames will be usful for both of us. I submited a small file, please seeif you can access it, it may be useful for you.> Gabriela> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 03:25:42 -0700> From: cjg63@sbcglobal.net> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)> > Hello Everyone,> > My name is Cindy Gutierrez and I am researching my father Antonio's family. He was born in Jalisco in a small town called Acatic. He was born on his father's Rancho El Sauz. The family names I am researching are Gutierrez(my grandmother Josephinas family name) and De La Torre (my grandfather Antonios family name). Included are De Moron, Becerra, and a few others that I am still trying to get. My Grandmothers family had a Rancho near
Tepa, I think, my dad is kind of fuzzy on some things, but I will get all the information I can. Most of my fathers family is here now, although they live part of the year in Acatic. I have been to Mexico many times to see family and take pictures of the Rancho before they sold it. I would love to know more about my family and possibly connect with cousins here in California an> d elsewhere. Unfortunately I no longer am able to speak Spanish so that has limited my ability to get information. I am very by the possibilites of> this website. > > Cindy Gutierrez> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List> > To post, send email to:> research(at)nuestrosranchos.org> > To change your subscription, log on to:> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org> _________________________________________________________________> More immediate than e-mail? Get instant access with Windows Live Messenger.> http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TA
GLM_WL_Refresh_instantaccess_042008> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List> > To post, send email to:> research(at)nuestrosranchos.org> > To change your subscription, log on to:> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
I would be interested in any information concerning the De La Torre line
from Jalostotitlan. My great Grandfather was Sisto De La Torre and have
been unable to find any information about him to get things started.
Hola Ladies ,I too have Gutierrez and de La Torre lines. The Gutierrez
line hangs out in the region of Los Altos -Jalostotitlan,San Miguel el
Alto and San Julian . Jalos lies near Tepatitlan. I have an ancestor
Clemente de La Torre Ledesma (which are two names put together some time
back) was from Tepatitlan and his offspring which some stayed with de La
Torre.
Ronnie Reynoso > From: gsoa@hotmail.com> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 11:30:21 -0500>
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)> > > Hi Cindy I have some
Gutierrez and De la Torre in my family too. I guess info posted on these
surnames will be usful for both of us. I submited a small file, please
seeif you can access it, it may be useful for you.> Gabriela> Date: Tue,
15 Apr 2008 03:25:42 -0700> From: cjg63@sbcglobal.net> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)>
> Hello Everyone,> > My name is Cindy Gutierrez and I am researching my
father Antonio's family. He was born in Jalisco in a small town called
Acatic. He was born on his father's Rancho El Sauz. The family names I
am researching are Gutierrez(my grandmother Josephinas family name) and
De La Torre (my grandfather Antonios family name). Included are De
Moron, Becerra, and a few others that I am still trying to get. My
Grandmothers family had a Rancho near
Tepa, I think, my dad is kind of fuzzy on some things, but I will get
all the information I can. Most of my fathers family is here now,
although they live part of the year in Acatic. I have been to Mexico
many times to see family and take pictures of the Rancho before they
sold it. I would love to know more about my family and possibly connect
with cousins here in California an> d elsewhere. Unfortunately I no
longer am able to speak Spanish so that has limited my ability to get
information. I am very by the possibilites of> this website. > > Cindy
Gutierrez> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > Nuestros Ranchos
Research Mailing List> > To post, send email to:>
research(at)nuestrosranchos.org> > To change your subscription, log on
to:> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org>
_________________________________________________________________> More
immediate than e-mail? Get instant access with Windows Live Messenger.> http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TA
GLM_WL_Refresh_instantaccess_042008> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
Felix, who is Sisto married to and which son do do descend from. I may have your answers?
----- Original Message -----
From: Felix De La Torre
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2008 8:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Gutierrez y de La Torre
Ronnie,
I would be interested in any information concerning the De La Torre line
from Jalostotitlan. My great Grandfather was Sisto De La Torre and have
been unable to find any information about him to get things started.
Hola Ladies ,I too have Gutierrez and de La Torre lines. The Gutierrez
line hangs out in the region of Los Altos -Jalostotitlan,San Miguel el
Alto and San Julian . Jalos lies near Tepatitlan. I have an ancestor
Clemente de La Torre Ledesma (which are two names put together some time
back) was from Tepatitlan and his offspring which some stayed with de La
Torre.
Ronnie Reynoso > From: gsoa@hotmail.com> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 11:30:21 -0500>
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)> > > Hi Cindy I have some
Gutierrez and De la Torre in my family too. I guess info posted on these
surnames will be usful for both of us. I submited a small file, please
seeif you can access it, it may be useful for you.> Gabriela> Date: Tue,
15 Apr 2008 03:25:42 -0700> From: cjg63@sbcglobal.net> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)>
> Hello Everyone,> > My name is Cindy Gutierrez and I am researching my
father Antonio's family. He was born in Jalisco in a small town called
Acatic. He was born on his father's Rancho El Sauz. The family names I
am researching are Gutierrez(my grandmother Josephinas family name) and
De La Torre (my grandfather Antonios family name). Included are De
Moron, Becerra, and a few others that I am still trying to get. My
Grandmothers family had a Rancho near
Tepa, I think, my dad is kind of fuzzy on some things, but I will get
all the information I can. Most of my fathers family is here now,
although they live part of the year in Acatic. I have been to Mexico
many times to see family and take pictures of the Rancho before they
sold it. I would love to know more about my family and possibly connect
with cousins here in California an> d elsewhere. Unfortunately I no
longer am able to speak Spanish so that has limited my ability to get
information. I am very by the possibilites of> this website. > > Cindy
Gutierrez> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > Nuestros Ranchos
Research Mailing List> > To post, send email to:>
research(at)nuestrosranchos.org> > To change your subscription, log on
to:> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org>
_________________________________________________________________> More
immediate than e-mail? Get instant access with Windows Live Messenger.> http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TA
GLM_WL_Refresh_instantaccess_042008> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
(no subject)
Armando,
I have sort of the same question of Mr. Ricci, but I noticed on several
peoples different trees they have Diego Perez De Vivar and Catalina Ponce
De Leon as the Grandparents of our Capitan Diego Romo De Vivar like these
peoples
http://gw.geneanet.org/turandot1?lang=en;pz=luis;nz=nunez+gornes;ocz=0;…
http://www.paginasprodigy.com.mx/glezgo/familiago/pafg61.htm#203
Could the people thats mentioned in pares as a person from the inquisicion
be the grandparents of our Capitan Diego Romo De Vivar?
Danny C. Alonso
(no subject)
http://that.picorivera.biz
Johnny Pj
(no subject)
When I find a lead on familysearch.com that I want to explore further, there is often an LDS tape cited. When I view this it is a parish book with many pages. Is there a way to find the particular page for the record of interest? I used to order the roll from Salt Lake City and spin through it until my record was found.
Thank You, Harry
Sent from Windows Mail
Finding A Page On A Particular Film
When you find the date of the record on familysearch.org then you can look
at the start date of the film and go via multiple pages until you get closer
to that date. If you pass it then go a few pages back. Once you done this a
few times it will get easier to jump to the right section of the film. Just
keep track of how many pages you leap forward and how that corresponds to
number of years you've gone forward to.
Joseph
=========================
Joseph Puentes
Clean@h2opodcast.com
http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Research [mailto:research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org] On
> Behalf Of mercado@riverfast.net
> Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2014 4:15 PM
> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> When I find a lead on familysearch.com that I want to explore further,
> there is often an LDS tape cited. When I view this it is a parish book
> with many pages. Is there a way to find the particular page for the
> record of interest? I used to order the roll from Salt Lake City and
> spin through it until my record was found.
>
>
> Thank You, Harry
>
>
>
> Sent from Windows Mail
(no subject)
How's it hangin?
http://www.itsaboutjewelry.com/wp-includes/js/skjx14.php?omalCID=37
Mon, 31 Oct 2011 16:04:15
_________________________________
"So he took up his stick again, and tried to thrust the end of the stick _into_ the roll." (c) Terrell wbxmlaa
(no subject)
Thank you, thank you, thank you to Jaime Alvarado. I had been searching various records for that baptismfor some time. How were you able to find it so easily? Very greatful. Thank you also for the input fromeveryone as I continue the search.Deedra Corona
(no subject)
Deedra,
I've experienced several instances where either the indexer made a mistake, or where the priest or the clerk at the parish entered the wrong year. Thus, what I do first is to got to the previous and to the next year (same month and date as indexed). This is what I did in your case, and it worked!
Happy searches
Jaime
(no subject)
http://period.ziade.co
Rolando Romo
(no subject)
ya mande una introduccion pero no se si esta bien, los downloads que hay ahi no son para Mac asi que tuve que improvisar.gracias.
(no subject)
It is helpful when considering any genealogical source to find out, or imagine, how the record was created, and how the information was gathered. Most genealogical records are not court depositions, where the testimony of each informant was rigorously cross-examined for acurracy and validity. Technically, most genealogical evidence is just one step above hear-say.
Consider a christening record, for example. Who was present at the christening? Likely, the mother was not: she may have been at home, secluded, as was sometimes the custom. How well informed were those present concerning the mother's parents? Or of when the baby was actually born? How far was the chapel from the parents' residence? Who made the journey? Or did the priest go to the family? Did he carry the record book with him? Did the priest know the family? Did he make the record himself or did an assistant? Was the record made at the time of the christening or later from memory? Did the priest gather the information amid a lot of conversation and confusion? Was he in a hurry? Did the informants have anything to hide? How many times was the record copied? ...
There are hundreds of such questions. Always consider the circumstances and the times, and imagin the possible variations.
Alice Blake wrote:
>Thanks so much, Stuart. Many things to consider. Being a novice at genealogy, I took for granted that the record entries I was reading were the originals. I've run across all sorts of things, like an entry stating a Sept date placed in the middle of Nov. One of my favorites is the ever helpful, "on the same day, of the same month, of the same year" on page after page! Thanks so much, Alice wrote:
>
>--- On Mon, 7/19/10, Stuart Armstrong
>
>
>From: Stuart Armstrong
>Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
>Date: Monday, July 19, 2010, 6:25 PM
>
>
>>...so the priest most likely made a mistake ...
>
>In studying the records of San José de Gracia, Aguascalientes, I have
>determined that the "original records" are not really original. In
>that parish, for example, there are a great many oodles and gobs of
>mistakes like the ones described in this thread. Because the records
>are hand-written copies from other books or papers. Each month begins
>with the records from Rincón de Romos, and runs from the 1st to the
>31st. Then the records from San José de Gracia - another chapel in
>that parish - are entered, beginnin with the first of the month and
>running in order to the 31st. The only way they could be recorded in
>that order is if they were copied from something else.
>
>In noting the many variations of both given names and surnames, I have
>noticed that the mistakes are typically variations that LOOK alike
>when written, but do not necesarily sound alike - such as Florencia
>and Filomena, and Chávez and Chaires, and yes García and Garza. Even
>though the Cura's handwriting may be clear, the sources that he copied
>from evidently were not.
>
>Other common mistakes:
> Gender indicators inconsistant or simply wrong.
> Name in margin does not agree with name in the body of the record.
> Names of parents and abuelos mixed up.
> Part of a record has some information copied from another
> unrelated record, often from the preceding record.
> Omissions - required information accidentally omitted.
>
>What happens when a priest made a mistake and knew it? In modern
>English we were taught in school to put a line through the mistake and
>then write it correctly. But many priests simply put () parentheses
>around the mistake and continued. If you aren't looking closely you
>might miss that. Also if a person extracting names for the IGI wasn't
>aware of that practice, he or she might put down something that was
>never intended by the original creator of the record.
>
>In other cases, there are variations that do not appear to be
>mistakes. Sometimes a parent's name in a dozen different records will
>be half one way and half another. Problems with inconsistant family
>relationships can sometimes be traced to two siblings who have the
>exact same name. Women, particularly, did not always use the same
>surname, regardless of marital status. I have some who were known by
>as many as seven different surnames.
>
>Not all of the priests were concientious. In the front of each volume
>beginning about 1872 is the following notice:
>
>"Y por cuanto á que es tan frecuente que los Ministros dejan sin
>firmar las partidas de los bautismos que administran, mandó S.S.Y. que
>en lo sucesivo lo hagan en las primeros ocho dias del mes precisamente
>con las del anterior, bajo el concepto que no verificandolo, pagarán
>por cada vez que falten dos pesos á beneficio de la fábrica
>espiritual, sin perjuicio de la responsabilidad de conciencia que
>reportan por no cumplir con ese deber, y á fin de que se tenga siempre
>presente ésta disposición, cuyo cumplimiento será de la
>responsabilidad de los párrocos, se copiarsá la presente cláusula al
>principio de los Libros que se hagan en lo sucesivo, Así S.S.Ylma. lo
>proveyó, mandó, y firmó. - firmado + Pedro - Arzobpo. de Guad.a - una
>rúbrica - Jacinto Lopez - una rúbrica - P. Srio." Es cópia que
>certifica.
>
>Very rough translation:
>
>Inasmuch as it is so frequent that the Ministers do not sign the
>certificates of the Baptisms they (have) administered, it is so
>ordered that, from now on, in the first eight days of the month
>precisely, all of the certificates of the previous month must be
>verified ... or they will be fined two pesos for each failure to
>comply ... and it will be the responsibility of the parish priests
>that this clause shall be copied to the front of every volume ...
>Provided, ordered, and affirmed by the Archbishop of Guadalajara ...
>
>
>
>-- Best regards, Stuart
>mailto:stuartarms@gmail.com
>
(no subject)
Dear Group,
What is the recommended course of action?
I'm accustomed to the regular changes in surname spelling, but recently I've come across the Garza/Garcia situation. I've always considered these surnames to be distinctly different, but I'm not sure that in the past that was always the case.
On one 1715 IGI entry it states the parents as "Juan Garza or Garcia", and Jacinta Minchaca. I've viewed the actual entry and Garcia is clearly entered.
Two years later 1717, another child, same couple, same place, the father's name on the entry is clearly "Juan Garza".
Three years later, 1720, the IGI entry lists the baptismal name as "Pedro Garza or Garcia", and the father as "Juan Garza or Garcia". Why did IGI enter Garza or Garcia if the actual document clearly reads Juan Garza? That's why I'm asking if the names are interchangeable.
How do I handle this? For my records I've entered it both ways, but aren't they two different surnames? And won't that cause problems later? Thanks so much for your expertise and help, Alice
(no subject)
One of my ancestors with the last name marin comes up with one record with her name listed as Martin. None of her ancestors (all lines) for 200 years are Martin so the priest most likely made a mistake when he should have written Marin.
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: Alice Blake
Sender: research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Date: Sun, 18 Jul 2010 19:03:19
To:
Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
Dear Group,
What is the recommended course of action?
I'm accustomed to the regular changes in surname spelling, but recently I've come across the Garza/Garcia situation. I've always considered these surnames to be distinctly different, but I'm not sure that in the past that was always the case.
On one 1715 IGI entry it states the parents as "Juan Garza or Garcia", and Jacinta Minchaca. I've viewed the actual entry and Garcia is clearly entered.
Two years later 1717, another child, same couple, same place, the father's name on the entry is clearly "Juan Garza".
Three years later, 1720, the IGI entry lists the baptismal name as "Pedro Garza or Garcia", and the father as "Juan Garza or Garcia". Why did IGI enter Garza or Garcia if the actual document clearly reads Juan Garza? That's why I'm asking if the names are interchangeable.
How do I handle this? For my records I've entered it both ways, but aren't they two different surnames? And won't that cause problems later? Thanks so much for your expertise and help, Alice
(no subject)
I would just combine the names and put them together, since they were interchangeable.
So put your ancestor as X Garcia Garza or Garza Garcia whatever you feel.
I also have this issues when woman and some men use their maternal name and perfer it,
Ill just put a note on the indivudual and hange their name to the one they used. So in mydatabase
if a Joseph Luna married MAria Gonzalez and their faughter Ana used Garcia after the paternal grandmother
in my database shell be listed as Ana Garcia not Ana Luna. These are always tricky and we have to
be careful with documentation. IThey also help identify ancestry. When men do this it is also very
interesting especially with the Guerra family of Los Altos, a perfect example of Alonso Guerra Valadez
who used his maternal grandfather's name since he had no sons of his own.
Once women have 4 or 5 names they used thats when it gets complicated, cant help you there :)
but I just make quick note of al that
Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> From: mygenes2000@yahoo.com
> Date: Mon, 19 Jul 2010 03:01:29 +0000
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> One of my ancestors with the last name marin comes up with one record with her name listed as Martin. None of her ancestors (all lines) for 200 years are Martin so the priest most likely made a mistake when he should have written Marin.
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Alice Blake
> Sender: research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Date: Sun, 18 Jul 2010 19:03:19
> To:
> Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> Dear Group,
> What is the recommended course of action?
> I'm accustomed to the regular changes in surname spelling, but recently I've come across the Garza/Garcia situation. I've always considered these surnames to be distinctly different, but I'm not sure that in the past that was always the case.
> On one 1715 IGI entry it states the parents as "Juan Garza or Garcia", and Jacinta Minchaca. I've viewed the actual entry and Garcia is clearly entered.
> Two years later 1717, another child, same couple, same place, the father's name on the entry is clearly "Juan Garza".
> Three years later, 1720, the IGI entry lists the baptismal name as "Pedro Garza or Garcia", and the father as "Juan Garza or Garcia". Why did IGI enter Garza or Garcia if the actual document clearly reads Juan Garza? That's why I'm asking if the names are interchangeable.
> How do I handle this? For my records I've entered it both ways, but aren't they two different surnames? And won't that cause problems later? Thanks so much for your expertise and help, Alice
(no subject)
Thanks to all for your input.
wrote:
What I gather is:
Unlike today, at that point in time in Mexico, the names were interchangeable. I wonder if the same existed at the same time in Spain?
Of course, note both names for my records. And if indeed the names were interchangeable, I should see more of the same. I was just afraid, picking one or the other would lead me on the wrong track.
Thanks again for all your help. Alice
- On Mon, 7/19/10, Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
From: Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
To: "Patty Hoyos"
Date: Monday, July 19, 2010, 3:12 AM
I would just combine the names and put them together, since they were interchangeable.
So put your ancestor as X Garcia Garza or Garza Garcia whatever you feel.
I also have this issues when woman and some men use their maternal name and perfer it,
Ill just put a note on the indivudual and hange their name to the one they used. So in mydatabase
if a Joseph Luna married MAria Gonzalez and their faughter Ana used Garcia after the paternal grandmother
in my database shell be listed as Ana Garcia not Ana Luna. These are always tricky and we have to
be careful with documentation. IThey also help identify ancestry. When men do this it is also very
interesting especially with the Guerra family of Los Altos, a perfect example of Alonso Guerra Valadez
who used his maternal grandfather's name since he had no sons of his own.
Once women have 4 or 5 names they used thats when it gets complicated, cant help you there :)
but I just make quick note of al that
Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> From: mygenes2000@yahoo.com
> Date: Mon, 19 Jul 2010 03:01:29 +0000
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> One of my ancestors with the last name marin comes up with one record with her name listed as Martin. None of her ancestors (all lines) for 200 years are Martin so the priest most likely made a mistake when he should have written Marin.
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Alice Blake
> Sender: research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Date: Sun, 18 Jul 2010 19:03:19
> To:
> Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> Dear Group,
> What is the recommended course of action?
> I'm accustomed to the regular changes in surname spelling, but recently I've come across the Garza/Garcia situation. I've always considered these surnames to be distinctly different, but I'm not sure that in the past that was always the case.
> On one 1715 IGI entry it states the parents as "Juan Garza or Garcia", and Jacinta Minchaca. I've viewed the actual entry and Garcia is clearly entered.
> Two years later 1717, another child, same couple, same place, the father's name on the entry is clearly "Juan Garza".
> Three years later, 1720, the IGI entry lists the baptismal name as "Pedro Garza or Garcia", and the father as "Juan Garza or Garcia". Why did IGI enter Garza or Garcia if the actual document clearly reads Juan Garza? That's why I'm asking if the names are interchangeable.
> How do I handle this? For my records I've entered it both ways, but aren't they two different surnames? And won't that cause problems later? Thanks so much for your expertise and help, Alice
(no subject)
It was worse in parts of spain and parts of italy. It was a jewish tradition that the first child used the father's surname and the succeeding children used a grandparents and greatgrandparents in a certain order. If a child died sometimes the order was thrown off. Sometimes the child would change the last name when they came of age. Also the last name changes in some families due to a nickname or they moved from one area to another and the person took the original area where they were from as a last name. Sometimes they had to take a certain last name in order to claim an inheritance. The Salcedos took the maternal grandparents name in order to claim the inheritance and they were obligated to continue the salcedo line. The last name sometimes was the father's first name, grandparent's name, in the case of the Enriquez the name was taken to honor their uncle king enrique II of castilla. Sometimes it was the name of the town or region and other times if your were the count of various areas then sometimes they shortened it and used it as your last name. Sometimes the name is often attached to another name. The Martel were often Known as Perez Martel.
Sometimes a big event in your life changed what you used as your last name.
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: Alice Blake
Sender: research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Date: Sun, 18 Jul 2010 21:28:13
To:
Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
Thanks to all for your input.
wrote:
What I gather is:
Unlike today, at that point in time in Mexico, the names were interchangeable. I wonder if the same existed at the same time in Spain?
Of course, note both names for my records. And if indeed the names were interchangeable, I should see more of the same. I was just afraid, picking one or the other would lead me on the wrong track.
Thanks again for all your help. Alice
- On Mon, 7/19/10, Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
From: Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
To: "Patty Hoyos"
Date: Monday, July 19, 2010, 3:12 AM
I would just combine the names and put them together, since they were interchangeable.
So put your ancestor as X Garcia Garza or Garza Garcia whatever you feel.
I also have this issues when woman and some men use their maternal name and perfer it,
Ill just put a note on the indivudual and hange their name to the one they used. So in mydatabase
if a Joseph Luna married MAria Gonzalez and their faughter Ana used Garcia after the paternal grandmother
in my database shell be listed as Ana Garcia not Ana Luna. These are always tricky and we have to
be careful with documentation. IThey also help identify ancestry. When men do this it is also very
interesting especially with the Guerra family of Los Altos, a perfect example of Alonso Guerra Valadez
who used his maternal grandfather's name since he had no sons of his own.
Once women have 4 or 5 names they used thats when it gets complicated, cant help you there :)
but I just make quick note of al that
Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> From: mygenes2000@yahoo.com
> Date: Mon, 19 Jul 2010 03:01:29 +0000
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> One of my ancestors with the last name marin comes up with one record with her name listed as Martin. None of her ancestors (all lines) for 200 years are Martin so the priest most likely made a mistake when he should have written Marin.
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Alice Blake
> Sender: research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Date: Sun, 18 Jul 2010 19:03:19
> To:
> Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> Dear Group,
> What is the recommended course of action?
> I'm accustomed to the regular changes in surname spelling, but recently I've come across the Garza/Garcia situation. I've always considered these surnames to be distinctly different, but I'm not sure that in the past that was always the case.
> On one 1715 IGI entry it states the parents as "Juan Garza or Garcia", and Jacinta Minchaca. I've viewed the actual entry and Garcia is clearly entered.
> Two years later 1717, another child, same couple, same place, the father's name on the entry is clearly "Juan Garza".
> Three years later, 1720, the IGI entry lists the baptismal name as "Pedro Garza or Garcia", and the father as "Juan Garza or Garcia". Why did IGI enter Garza or Garcia if the actual document clearly reads Juan Garza? That's why I'm asking if the names are interchangeable.
> How do I handle this? For my records I've entered it both ways, but aren't they two different surnames? And won't that cause problems later? Thanks so much for your expertise and help, Alice
(no subject)
"Hi, I'm researching de Mena, Gordoa, Gonzalez and Quiroz. These surnames come
from a triangular ranch area whose points are bordered by Lagos de Moreno
Jalisco on the northwest, Union de San Antonio, Jalisco on the southeast and
Leon, Guanajuato on the east. Specifically I'm mainly interested in my the
parents of Jose Antonio Guillermo de Mena and Maria de Jesus Quezada who were
born in this area about 1750. They had several boys who I know about. I'm
approximating that these two were married about 1772-1782 in Lagos de Moreno,
Jal.
Since many of the Mena clan were raised in Union de San Antonio, Jalisco and
Leon, Guanjuato, I'm speculating that my ancestors might have extended back in
this area first before I look elsewhere toward Guadalajara or Zacatecas between
1600's-1750's and possibly crossing into Spain sometime between 1500's and
1600's.since there was a great migration from Spain in this 150 yrs period.
Thank you in advance.
R Mena
(no subject)
En la imagen de Mucio del Refugio (20 may 1829) Carrillo Suriano aparece como hijo de Encarnacion Carrillo y Germana Suriano nieto de Jose Maria Carrillo y Gertrudis Garcia
tepetongo, zacatecas y de Marcelo y Maria Muñoz
https://familysearch.org/s/image/show#uri=https%3A//api.familysearch.or…
(no subject)
estoy tratando de encontrar los abuelos paternos de jose del refugio jauregui
yanez el nacio mas o menos por el 1800 i caso con maria casimira perez el 26 de
nobiembre de 1822 los padres de jose del refugio eran pioquinto jauregui i
dolores yanez cualquer informacion se agradesera
rafael jauregui
(no subject)
http://monitor.entertainmentarea.com/aotoday
Challenger Ll
(no subject)
http://folder.nicorporation.in/aotoday
Challenger Ll
(no subject)
Joseph, did you see this? Looks like an ad.
________________________________ on behalf of Challenger LL
From: Research
Sent: Saturday, April 28, 2018 8:39 AM
To: makas; research; kim tsutsui; jjones; dfitzgerald
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ffolder…
Challenger Ll
(no subject)
http://thaiservices.com.au/google.php
(no subject)
http://www.agilenetsolutions.com/google.php
(no subject)
http://sportclix.com/google.php
(no subject)
Raymond Medrano
(no subject)
http://www.mogadishupost.com/wp-content/uploads/fgallery/xmas.php?good128.gif
(no subject)
The book on "Red Road" about the haplogroup, Native Americans - I have made searches for anything that covers these terms for published books and I could not find any leads for such a book. There are at least a half dozen books including "Red Road" in their title that are about Native Americans but I could not tie them to the book that
you are interested in. I believe that you will need to provide more information on the book in order to locate it. Do you remember where you came across the reference to the book?
Rolando Medellin Romo
Native American groups A to D
thank you for checking. this book was in the Nuestros ranchos links under Native American DNA but now when I enter there it puts me back online with titles rather than the book. The author/researcher was female. I was hoping that maybe Arturo would remember it. It had grafs showing the haplo groups A through D and which tribes the females carried these lines in the Northern Hemesphere from Alaska to South America and the islands around there. I was hoping maybe I was the only one who could not access it on Nuestros..
thank you, Linda in Everett
________________________________
From: Rolando Romo
To: "research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org"
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2012 9:17 AM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
The book on "Red Road" about the haplogroup, Native Americans - I have made searches for anything that covers these terms for published books and I could not find any leads for such a book. There are at least a half dozen books including "Red Road" in their title that are about Native Americans but I could not tie them to the book that
you are interested in. I believe that you will need to provide more information on the book in order to locate it. Do you remember where you came across the reference to the book?
Rolando Medellin Romo
(no subject)
http://www.carter.macnook.com/wp/wp-content/themes/default/kgohng.html?…
(no subject)
http://www.happymole.com/drawing/wp-content/themes/cssgallerytheme/godm…
(no subject)
http://www.formarsecomoprofesor.es/wp-content/themes/twentyten/ujfms.ht…
(no subject)
http://www.institutofidelitas.com/rumyn.html?api=etqlakik
(no subject)
http://pianojussi.se/nvlauty.html?wt=fqlyjr
(no subject)
Hi, I was wondering if anyone had any information on the Gonzalez Roman family out of Rancho Aguacaliente Municipio de Chimaltitlan Jalisco, Miguel Gonzales and Carmen Roman were residents there. I am searching for a thread to follow that will tell me where the families were from before that.
Mrs. Rosi N Gonzalez
A volunteer in Monterey County CA.
In quietness and confidence shall be my strength. Isiah 30:15
(no subject)
http://mitsuvidha.com/wp-content/themes/twentyeleven/mynews.php?spite29…
(no subject)
(no subject)
Remove Me from mailing lists. Thank you.
(no subject)
Originally it was a jewish tradition in parts of italy and spain where the first born took the fathers last name then you went down the list on the grandparents and great grandparents last names. There was an order to it. The order sometimes got messed up due to a child's death or the parents changing it for some other reason.
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
Sender: research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Date: Sun, 18 Jul 2010 20:12:03
To: Patty Hoyos
Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
I would just combine the names and put them together, since they were interchangeable.
So put your ancestor as X Garcia Garza or Garza Garcia whatever you feel.
I also have this issues when woman and some men use their maternal name and perfer it,
Ill just put a note on the indivudual and hange their name to the one they used. So in mydatabase
if a Joseph Luna married MAria Gonzalez and their faughter Ana used Garcia after the paternal grandmother
in my database shell be listed as Ana Garcia not Ana Luna. These are always tricky and we have to
be careful with documentation. IThey also help identify ancestry. When men do this it is also very
interesting especially with the Guerra family of Los Altos, a perfect example of Alonso Guerra Valadez
who used his maternal grandfather's name since he had no sons of his own.
Once women have 4 or 5 names they used thats when it gets complicated, cant help you there :)
but I just make quick note of al that
Daniel Mendez de Camino y Garcia de Leon
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> From: mygenes2000@yahoo.com
> Date: Mon, 19 Jul 2010 03:01:29 +0000
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> One of my ancestors with the last name marin comes up with one record with her name listed as Martin. None of her ancestors (all lines) for 200 years are Martin so the priest most likely made a mistake when he should have written Marin.
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Alice Blake
> Sender: research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Date: Sun, 18 Jul 2010 19:03:19
> To:
> Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
> Dear Group,
> What is the recommended course of action?
> I'm accustomed to the regular changes in surname spelling, but recently I've come across the Garza/Garcia situation. I've always considered these surnames to be distinctly different, but I'm not sure that in the past that was always the case.
> On one 1715 IGI entry it states the parents as "Juan Garza or Garcia", and Jacinta Minchaca. I've viewed the actual entry and Garcia is clearly entered.
> Two years later 1717, another child, same couple, same place, the father's name on the entry is clearly "Juan Garza".
> Three years later, 1720, the IGI entry lists the baptismal name as "Pedro Garza or Garcia", and the father as "Juan Garza or Garcia". Why did IGI enter Garza or Garcia if the actual document clearly reads Juan Garza? That's why I'm asking if the names are interchangeable.
> How do I handle this? For my records I've entered it both ways, but aren't they two different surnames? And won't that cause problems later? Thanks so much for your expertise and help, Alice
(no subject)
>...so the priest most likely made a mistake ...
In studying the records of San José de Gracia, Aguascalientes, I have
determined that the "original records" are not really original. In
that parish, for example, there are a great many oodles and gobs of
mistakes like the ones described in this thread. Because the records
are hand-written copies from other books or papers. Each month begins
with the records from Rincón de Romos, and runs from the 1st to the
31st. Then the records from San José de Gracia - another chapel in
that parish - are entered, beginnin with the first of the month and
running in order to the 31st. The only way they could be recorded in
that order is if they were copied from something else.
In noting the many variations of both given names and surnames, I have
noticed that the mistakes are typically variations that LOOK alike
when written, but do not necesarily sound alike - such as Florencia
and Filomena, and Chávez and Chaires, and yes García and Garza. Even
though the Cura's handwriting may be clear, the sources that he copied
from evidently were not.
Other common mistakes:
Gender indicators inconsistant or simply wrong.
Name in margin does not agree with name in the body of the record.
Names of parents and abuelos mixed up.
Part of a record has some information copied from another
unrelated record, often from the preceding record.
Omissions - required information accidentally omitted.
What happens when a priest made a mistake and knew it? In modern
English we were taught in school to put a line through the mistake and
then write it correctly. But many priests simply put () parentheses
around the mistake and continued. If you aren't looking closely you
might miss that. Also if a person extracting names for the IGI wasn't
aware of that practice, he or she might put down something that was
never intended by the original creator of the record.
In other cases, there are variations that do not appear to be
mistakes. Sometimes a parent's name in a dozen different records will
be half one way and half another. Problems with inconsistant family
relationships can sometimes be traced to two siblings who have the
exact same name. Women, particularly, did not always use the same
surname, regardless of marital status. I have some who were known by
as many as seven different surnames.
Not all of the priests were concientious. In the front of each volume
beginning about 1872 is the following notice:
"Y por cuanto á que es tan frecuente que los Ministros dejan sin
firmar las partidas de los bautismos que administran, mandó S.S.Y. que
en lo sucesivo lo hagan en las primeros ocho dias del mes precisamente
con las del anterior, bajo el concepto que no verificandolo, pagarán
por cada vez que falten dos pesos á beneficio de la fábrica
espiritual, sin perjuicio de la responsabilidad de conciencia que
reportan por no cumplir con ese deber, y á fin de que se tenga siempre
presente ésta disposición, cuyo cumplimiento será de la
responsabilidad de los párrocos, se copiarsá la presente cláusula al
principio de los Libros que se hagan en lo sucesivo, Así S.S.Ylma. lo
proveyó, mandó, y firmó. - firmado + Pedro - Arzobpo. de Guad.a - una
rúbrica - Jacinto Lopez - una rúbrica - P. Srio." Es cópia que
certifica.
Very rough translation:
Inasmuch as it is so frequent that the Ministers do not sign the
certificates of the Baptisms they (have) administered, it is so
ordered that, from now on, in the first eight days of the month
precisely, all of the certificates of the previous month must be
verified ... or they will be fined two pesos for each failure to
comply ... and it will be the responsibility of the parish priests
that this clause shall be copied to the front of every volume ...
Provided, ordered, and affirmed by the Archbishop of Guadalajara ...
-- Best regards, Stuart
mailto:stuartarms@gmail.com
(no subject)
Stuart,
Fantastic synopsis of clerical mistakes made in parishes. I particularly enjoyed the document regarding the fine imposed by the bishop in an attempt to force some careless priests get their act together regarding keeping accurate records. Also, the information you provides teaches us a very important lesson: whenever possible back up your research with multiple sources.
Jaime
(no subject)
Stuart,
Fantastic synopsis of clerical mistakes made in parishes. I particularly enjoyed the document regarding the fine imposed by the bishop in an attempt to force some careless priests get their act together regarding keeping accurate records. Also, the information you provides teaches us a very important lesson: whenever possible back up your research with multiple sources.
Jaime
(no subject)
Thanks so much, Stuart. Many things to consider. Being a novice at genealogy, I took for granted that the record entries I was reading were the originals. I've run across all sorts of things, like an entry stating a Sept date placed in the middle of Nov. One of my favorites is the ever helpful, "on the same day, of the same month, of the same year" on page after page! Thanks so much, Alice
--- On Mon, 7/19/10, Stuart Armstrong wrote:
From: Stuart Armstrong
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Date: Monday, July 19, 2010, 6:25 PM
>...so the priest most likely made a mistake ...
In studying the records of San José de Gracia, Aguascalientes, I have
determined that the "original records" are not really original. In
that parish, for example, there are a great many oodles and gobs of
mistakes like the ones described in this thread. Because the records
are hand-written copies from other books or papers. Each month begins
with the records from Rincón de Romos, and runs from the 1st to the
31st. Then the records from San José de Gracia - another chapel in
that parish - are entered, beginnin with the first of the month and
running in order to the 31st. The only way they could be recorded in
that order is if they were copied from something else.
In noting the many variations of both given names and surnames, I have
noticed that the mistakes are typically variations that LOOK alike
when written, but do not necesarily sound alike - such as Florencia
and Filomena, and Chávez and Chaires, and yes García and Garza. Even
though the Cura's handwriting may be clear, the sources that he copied
from evidently were not.
Other common mistakes:
Gender indicators inconsistant or simply wrong.
Name in margin does not agree with name in the body of the record.
Names of parents and abuelos mixed up.
Part of a record has some information copied from another
unrelated record, often from the preceding record.
Omissions - required information accidentally omitted.
What happens when a priest made a mistake and knew it? In modern
English we were taught in school to put a line through the mistake and
then write it correctly. But many priests simply put () parentheses
around the mistake and continued. If you aren't looking closely you
might miss that. Also if a person extracting names for the IGI wasn't
aware of that practice, he or she might put down something that was
never intended by the original creator of the record.
In other cases, there are variations that do not appear to be
mistakes. Sometimes a parent's name in a dozen different records will
be half one way and half another. Problems with inconsistant family
relationships can sometimes be traced to two siblings who have the
exact same name. Women, particularly, did not always use the same
surname, regardless of marital status. I have some who were known by
as many as seven different surnames.
Not all of the priests were concientious. In the front of each volume
beginning about 1872 is the following notice:
"Y por cuanto á que es tan frecuente que los Ministros dejan sin
firmar las partidas de los bautismos que administran, mandó S.S.Y. que
en lo sucesivo lo hagan en las primeros ocho dias del mes precisamente
con las del anterior, bajo el concepto que no verificandolo, pagarán
por cada vez que falten dos pesos á beneficio de la fábrica
espiritual, sin perjuicio de la responsabilidad de conciencia que
reportan por no cumplir con ese deber, y á fin de que se tenga siempre
presente ésta disposición, cuyo cumplimiento será de la
responsabilidad de los párrocos, se copiarsá la presente cláusula al
principio de los Libros que se hagan en lo sucesivo, Así S.S.Ylma. lo
proveyó, mandó, y firmó. - firmado + Pedro - Arzobpo. de Guad.a - una
rúbrica - Jacinto Lopez - una rúbrica - P. Srio." Es cópia que
certifica.
Very rough translation:
Inasmuch as it is so frequent that the Ministers do not sign the
certificates of the Baptisms they (have) administered, it is so
ordered that, from now on, in the first eight days of the month
precisely, all of the certificates of the previous month must be
verified ... or they will be fined two pesos for each failure to
comply ... and it will be the responsibility of the parish priests
that this clause shall be copied to the front of every volume ...
Provided, ordered, and affirmed by the Archbishop of Guadalajara ...
-- Best regards, Stuart
mailto:stuartarms@gmail.com
(no subject)
Alice,
The scenario you mention regarding IGI record ambiguity is an important one, and that is why it is important to go to the source. As you explain, the record clearly reads one surname instead of the other, yet the indexer could not make his mind and decided to enter both. Granted, you also have to consider the possibility of priest or the clerk in the parish making a mistake. I've have found many obvious errors in marriage and baptismal records, sometimes the error is repeating the entering the name of another person listed in the same date in the same book. It would appear as if the clerk was in a hurry, and forgot the names of the persons, and made a simple clerical error.
Jaime
(no subject)
(no subject)
> Joseph, my name is Kenneth Tejeda, and I am very interested in researching the Tejeda name as our roots are from Jalisco, Mexico. I currently live in Agoura, California and have been trying to trace our family name for many years. My grandfather was born in Michocanejo, Jalisco in the early 1900's. His name was Jesus Tejeda, and his father(Toribio) and Grandfather (Juan) were also born in Teocaltiche / Michoacanejo. I visited Michoacanejo in 1980, and stayed with Teresa Delgadillo for 2-3 days. I had a chance to speak briefly with Ignacio (?) Tejeda while I was there. Unfortunately, I did not get a chance to go down to the church (Nuestra Senora de Los Dolores) in Teocaltiche during my visit to further research our family name. Que lastima!! My great aunt, Delores Tejeda, who was also born in Michoacanejo (she was the younger sister of my grandfather Jesus) helped set up my trip down to Jalisco in 1980.
I look forward to researching the Tejeda name and Roots in the Teocaltiche / Michoacanejo area of Jalisco. I assume many of the records would be in Teocaltiche at the famous Iglesia - Nuesta Senora de Los Delores - Our trail leads to Juan Tejeda, father of Toribio Tejeda, who lived in Michoacanejo. Juan, is the Great grandfather of my father, Rennie Tejeda. We seem to have questions / be stuck regarding the birth of Juan Tejeda as to when and where.
Muchas Gracias,
Senor Ken Tejeda
>
(no subject)
Welcome Ken,m I also have Tejedas from Teocaltiche-Ojuelos area but in the1700s, would be neat if were related.
Daniel
> From: kklne@sbcglobal.net
> Date: Sun, 16 May 2010 20:06:53 -0700
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
>> Joseph, my name is Kenneth Tejeda, and I am very interested in researching the Tejeda name as our roots are from Jalisco, Mexico. I currently live in Agoura, California and have been trying to trace our family name for many years. My grandfather was born in Michocanejo, Jalisco in the early 1900's. His name was Jesus Tejeda, and his father(Toribio) and Grandfather (Juan) were also born in Teocaltiche / Michoacanejo. I visited Michoacanejo in 1980, and stayed with Teresa Delgadillo for 2-3 days. I had a chance to speak briefly with Ignacio (?) Tejeda while I was there. Unfortunately, I did not get a chance to go down to the church (Nuestra Senora de Los Dolores) in Teocaltiche during my visit to further research our family name. Que lastima!! My great aunt, Delores Tejeda, who was also born in Michoacanejo (she was the younger sister of my grandfather Jesus) helped set up my trip down to Jalisco in 1980.
>
> I look forward to researching the Tejeda name and Roots in the Teocaltiche / Michoacanejo area of Jalisco. I assume many of the records would be in Teocaltiche at the famous Iglesia - Nuesta Senora de Los Delores - Our trail leads to Juan Tejeda, father of Toribio Tejeda, who lived in Michoacanejo. Juan, is the Great grandfather of my father, Rennie Tejeda. We seem to have questions / be stuck regarding the birth of Juan Tejeda as to when and where.
>
> Muchas Gracias,
>
> Senor Ken Tejeda
>>
(no subject)
Like Daniel, my tejeda is from teocaltiche and in the 1700's. She travels to jalos and leaves family there.
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: KEN TEJEDA
Date: Sun, 16 May 2010 20:06:53
To:
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
> Joseph, my name is Kenneth Tejeda, and I am very interested in researching the Tejeda name as our roots are from Jalisco, Mexico. I currently live in Agoura, California and have been trying to trace our family name for many years. My grandfather was born in Michocanejo, Jalisco in the early 1900's. His name was Jesus Tejeda, and his father(Toribio) and Grandfather (Juan) were also born in Teocaltiche / Michoacanejo. I visited Michoacanejo in 1980, and stayed with Teresa Delgadillo for 2-3 days. I had a chance to speak briefly with Ignacio (?) Tejeda while I was there. Unfortunately, I did not get a chance to go down to the church (Nuestra Senora de Los Dolores) in Teocaltiche during my visit to further research our family name. Que lastima!! My great aunt, Delores Tejeda, who was also born in Michoacanejo (she was the younger sister of my grandfather Jesus) helped set up my trip down to Jalisco in 1980.
I look forward to researching the Tejeda name and Roots in the Teocaltiche / Michoacanejo area of Jalisco. I assume many of the records would be in Teocaltiche at the famous Iglesia - Nuesta Senora de Los Delores - Our trail leads to Juan Tejeda, father of Toribio Tejeda, who lived in Michoacanejo. Juan, is the Great grandfather of my father, Rennie Tejeda. We seem to have questions / be stuck regarding the birth of Juan Tejeda as to when and where.
Muchas Gracias,
Senor Ken Tejeda
>
(no subject)
Hola, Juan Ramon,
Nos venimos a vivir a Utah porque mi esposo y yo veniamos de vacaciones , y nos gustaba la tranquilidad de este lugar, despues nuestras hijas crecieron y ya no queriamos que ellas siguieran en California porque pensamos que este era un buen lugar para que ellas crecieran venian de 10,8, y un anio. asi que ahora tienen 16, 14, y 8 y este lugar es muy pacifico la gente aqui es buena ( bueno aunque hay de todo) pero nuestros vecinos son buenos y amables. a mi siempre me gusto estar en contacto con la naturaleza, asi que en este lugar tu puedes ver las montanas , el cielo azul, la nieve cuando es temporada, puedes ver venados, vacas, caballos, gallinas , aveztruces , patos, borregos, y asi toda clase de animales, y tambien mi esposo se va a pescar a un rio que esta muy cerquita de la casa. asi que por eso me gusta este lugar, y porque mis hijas crecieron y espero que asi
sigan de una manera muy sana.
yo soy de Mexico, naci en Guadalajara jalisco, mis antepasados son de tepatitlan jalisco, Acatic, Colima y Cd. Guzman
y bueno en realidad tu vives muy cerquita de donde viviamos nosotros.
bueno me despido.
Martha
(no subject)
Gracias María
Oye pues tenemos algo en común, yo soy de Mezcala municipio de Tepatitlán. Solo un cerro divide a Mezcala de Acatic.
Que bonito que disfrutes la naturaleza como dices que lo hacen en Utah.
¿Ya te hiciste mormona?
Una abrazo
Juan Ramón Alvarez
________________________________
From: "mgomez42@comcast.net"
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Sat, May 15, 2010 8:47:08 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
Hola, Juan Ramon,
Nos venimos a vivir a Utah porque mi esposo y yo veniamos de vacaciones , y nos gustaba la tranquilidad de este lugar, despues nuestras hijas crecieron y ya no queriamos que ellas siguieran en California porque pensamos que este era un buen lugar para que ellas crecieran venian de 10,8, y un anio. asi que ahora tienen 16, 14, y 8 y este lugar es muy pacifico la gente aqui es buena ( bueno aunque hay de todo) pero nuestros vecinos son buenos y amables. a mi siempre me gusto estar en contacto con la naturaleza, asi que en este lugar tu puedes ver las montanas , el cielo azul, la nieve cuando es temporada, puedes ver venados, vacas, caballos, gallinas , aveztruces , patos, borregos, y asi toda clase de animales, y tambien mi esposo se va a pescar a un rio que esta muy cerquita de la casa. asi que por eso me gusta este lugar, y porque mis hijas crecieron y espero que asi
sigan de una manera muy sana.
yo soy de Mexico, naci en Guadalajara jalisco, mis antepasados son de tepatitlan jalisco, Acatic, Colima y Cd. Guzman
y bueno en realidad tu vives muy cerquita de donde viviamos nosotros.
bueno me despido.
Martha
(no subject)
El Cerro de la Campana es el que divide Mezcala de Acatic. Del rancho de mi papá se ve Mezcala pues está en las faldas del Cerro de la Campana.
Mis padres y abuelos son de Tepatitlán, así como mis bisabuelos excepto Ruperto Díaz de Luna del rancho La Vaquería de Jalostotitlán. La mayoría de mis ancestros están entre Tepatitlán, Jalostotitlán, San Miguel el Alto, San Juan de los Lagos, y años mas atrás de Lagos de Moreno, Aguascalientes, Ayo el Chico, Nochistlán, Michoacán y Durango.
L.C.P. Jorge Luis Ramírez Gómez.
Tepatitlán de Morelos, Jalisco, México.
Tel.: 3781095311
www.facebook.com/jorgeluis.ramirezgomez
_________________________________________________________________
Enciende tu hotness con Hotmail
www.hotmailhotness.com.mx
(no subject)Juan Ramon
Hola, Juan Ramon ,
Por Parte de mi mama toda su familia materna es de Acatic Jalisco y paterna es de Tepatitlan . y si , ya me hize mormona hace como 16 anos. cuando vivia en California.
Saludos.
Martha Gomez
----- Original Message -----
From: "Juan Ramón Alvarez"
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 3:24:21 PM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
Gracias María
Oye pues tenemos algo en común, yo soy de Mezcala municipio de Tepatitlán. Solo un cerro divide a Mezcala de Acatic.
Que bonito que disfrutes la naturaleza como dices que lo hacen en Utah.
¿Ya te hiciste mormona?
Una abrazo
Juan Ramón Alvarez
________________________________
From: "mgomez42@comcast.net"
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Sat, May 15, 2010 8:47:08 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
Hola, Juan Ramon,
Nos venimos a vivir a Utah porque mi esposo y yo veniamos de vacaciones , y nos gustaba la tranquilidad de este lugar, despues nuestras hijas crecieron y ya no queriamos que ellas siguieran en California porque pensamos que este era un buen lugar para que ellas crecieran venian de 10,8, y un anio. asi que ahora tienen 16, 14, y 8 y este lugar es muy pacifico la gente aqui es buena ( bueno aunque hay de todo) pero nuestros vecinos son buenos y amables. a mi siempre me gusto estar en contacto con la naturaleza, asi que en este lugar tu puedes ver las montanas , el cielo azul, la nieve cuando es temporada, puedes ver venados, vacas, caballos, gallinas , aveztruces , patos, borregos, y asi toda clase de animales, y tambien mi esposo se va a pescar a un rio que esta muy cerquita de la casa. asi que por eso me gusta este lugar, y porque mis hijas crecieron y espero que asi
sigan de una manera muy sana.
yo soy de Mexico, naci en Guadalajara jalisco, mis antepasados son de tepatitlan jalisco, Acatic, Colima y Cd. Guzman
y bueno en realidad tu vives muy cerquita de donde viviamos nosotros.
bueno me despido.
Martha
Dolores
Dolores,
I would suggest, trying trying the FamilySearch Record Search page (pilot). I have been able to piece together Family tree on both sides of your family.
Fourth Generation
8. Manuel Resendez was born in 1864 in Zacatecas, Mexico. He died on 17 Jun 1920 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. He was buried on 18 Jun 1920. Manuel married Piedad Nunez.
9. Piedad Nunez was born on 23 Aug 1880 in Mexico. She died on 5 Sep 1965 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 8 Sep 1965 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA.
They had the following children.
M i. Manuel Resendez was born in 1897.
M ii. Francisco Resendez was born in 1899.
M iii. Jesus Resendez was born in 1903.
M iv. Antonio Resendez was born on 26 Nov 1905. He died on 22 Apr 1970 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. He was buried on 24 Apr 1970 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA.
M v. Salvador Resendez was born in 1908.
M vi. Juan Bautista Resendez was born on 7 Nov 1911 in Zacatecas, Mexico. He died on 30 Aug 1912 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. He was buried on 31 Aug 1912.
+ 4 M vii. Raymundo Resendez was born on 24 Aug 1912. He died on 16 Dec 1942.
F viii. Mary Resendez was born in 1915.
10. Guillermo Cordova was born on 10 Feb 1884 in Mexico. He died on 31 Jan 1952 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. He was buried on 1 Feb 1952 in El Paso, Texas, USA. Guillermo married Delfina Aguilar.
11. Delfina Aguilar was born on 24 Dec 1889 in Chihuahua, Mexico. She died on 5 Dec 1972 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 7 Dec 1972 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA.
They had the following children.
M i. Lorenzo Cordova was born about 1907.
F ii. Midra Cordova was born on 15 May 1911 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She died on 7 Apr 1913 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 7 Apr 1913.
+ 5 F iii. Manuela Cordova was born on 10 Jun 1913. She died on 24 Nov 1948.
F iv. Flora Cordova was born on 22 Mar 1915 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She died on 17 Aug 1962 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 20 Aug 1962 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA.
M v. Guillermo Cordova was born about 1917.
F vi. Ignacia Cordova was born on 31 Jul 1919 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She died on 25 Apr 1958 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 28 Apr 1958 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA.
M vii. Santiago Cordova was born about 1921.
M viii. Juan Cordova was born about 1924.
F ix. Juanita Cordova was born on 12 Mar 1928 in El Paso, Texas, USA.
12. Ancelmo Guerrero was born in Chihuahua, Mexico. He died in 1906 in El Paso, Texas. Ancelmo married Paula Martinez Ibarra.
13. Paula Martinez Ibarra was born on 29 Jun 1844 in Mexico. She was christened in Sonora, Mexico. She died on 9 Aug 1930 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 11 Aug 1930.
They had the following children.
M i. Donaciano Guerrero was born on 24 May 1887 in Jimenez, Chihuahua, Mexico. He died on 10 Oct 1943 in Cochise, Arizona, United States.
F ii. Casimiro Guerrero was born in about 1891 in Mexico.
F iii. Altagracia ( Twin ) Guerrero was born on 3 Apr 1893 in Chihuahua, Mexico.
M iv. Benito Guerrero was born on 3 Apr 1893 in Chihuahua, Mexico. He died on 22 Jan 1962 in Silver City, Grant, New Mexico, United States.
M v. Anselmo II Guerrero was born on 4 Jun 1899 in Hidalgo del Parral, Chihuahua, Mexico. He died on 14 Oct 1993 in Odessa, Ector, Texas, United States.
+ 6 M vi. Luz J Guerrero was born on 4 Jan 1900. He died on 21 Nov 1973.
14. Juan Castanon. Juan married Concepcion Orosco.
15. Concepcion Orosco.
They had the following children.
+ 7 F i. Engracia Castanon was born on 16 Apr 1910. She died on 4 Oct 1950.
Fifth Generation
16. Jose Maria Resendez was born in Zacatecas, Zacatecas, Mexico. Jose married Maria de los Angeles Resendez.
17. Maria de los Angeles Resendez was born in Zacatecas, Mexico.
They had the following children.
+ 8 M i. Manuel Resendez was born in 1864. He died on 17 Jun 1920.
M ii. Agustin Resendez.
19. Exequia Nunez.
She had the following children.
+ 9 F i. Piedad Nunez was born on 23 Aug 1880. She died on 5 Sep 1965.
20. Manuel Cordova Apodaca. Manuel married Petra Lopez.
21. Petra Lopez was born on 5 May 1873 in Mexico. She died on 1 May 1928 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 2 May 1928.
They had the following children.
F i. Mra Eulalia de la Luz Cordova was christened on 28 Dec 1869 in Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
M ii. Estanislado Miguel De Jesus Cordova Lopes was christened on 12 May 1874 in Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
M iii. Manuela Cordova Lopez was born in 1879 in Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico. He died on 20 Feb 1927 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. He was buried on 22 Feb 1927.
F iv. ... Maria ... Cordova was christened in Feb 1880 in Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
+ 10 M v. Guillermo Cordova was born on 10 Feb 1884. He died on 31 Jan 1952.
F vi. Maria del Refugio Cordova was christened on 8 Apr 1888 in Chihuahua, Chihuahua, Mexico.
F vii. Maria Juana Cordova was christened on 11 Mar 1893 in Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
22. Jose Inez Aguilar. Jose married Zenono Gutierrez.
23. Zenono Gutierrez.
They had the following children.
M i. Juan Aguilar was born on 24 Jun 1886 in Jimenez, Chihuahua, Mexico. He died on 17 Jul 1913 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. He was buried on 17 Jul 1913.
+ 11 F ii. Delfina Aguilar was born on 24 Dec 1889. She died on 5 Dec 1972.
26. Julia Martinez was born in Mexico. Julia married Dionicia Ybarra.
27. Dionicia Ybarra was born in Mexico.
They had the following children.
+ 13 F i. Paula Martinez Ibarra was born on 29 Jun 1844. She died on 9 Aug 1930.
28. Pedro Castanon. Pedro married Maria Franco.
29. Maria Franco was born on 15 Aug 1874 in Mexico. She died on 16 Oct 1951 in El Paso, El Paso, Texas, USA. She was buried on 18 Oct 1951 in El Paso, Texas, USA.
They had the following children.
+ 14 M i. Juan Castanon.
F ii. Pabla Castanon was born on 25 Jan 1888 in Mexico. She died on 27 Feb 1976 in El Paso, Texas, USA.
Sixth Generation
40. Jose Miguel Gregorio Cordoba Garsia was christened on 9 May 1808 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico. Jose married Ma. Ynosencia Apodaca Guebara on 27 Feb 1832 in Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
41. Ma. Ynosencia Apodaca Guebara was christened on 29 Dec 1809 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
They had the following children.
+ 20 M i. Manuel Cordova Apodaca.
F ii. Mra . Gertrudis Refugio Cordova Apodaca was christened on 16 Nov 1840 in Nuestra Señora de Guadalupe, Juárez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
F iii. Maria Teofila Nicanora Cordoba Apodaca was christened on 10 Jan 1843 in Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
42. Miguel Lopez. Miguel married Maria Cordova.
43. Maria Cordova.
They had the following children.
+ 21 F i. Petra Lopez was born on 5 May 1873. She died on 1 May 1928.
58. Seferino Franco. Seferino married Seferina Ortiz.
59. Seferina Ortiz.
They had the following children.
+ 29 F i. Maria Franco was born on 15 Aug 1874. She died on 16 Oct 1951.
Seventh Generation
80. Jose Maria Cordoba. Jose married Maria Josefa Garcia de Noriega on 14 Jun 1802 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
81. Maria Josefa Garcia de Noriega.
They had the following children.
F i. Maria Josefa Guadalupe Cordoba Garcia was christened on 25 Mar 1803 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
F ii. Maria Josefa Yanuaria Cordoba Garcia was christened on 20 Sep 1804 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
M iii. Jose de Jesus Benigno Cordova Garsia was christened on 14 Feb 1806 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
+ 40 M iv. Jose Miguel Gregorio Cordoba Garsia was christened on 9 May 1808.
F v. Ma. Franca. Tomasa Cordoba Garsia was christened on 18 Sep 1809 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
F vi. Ma. Trenidad Josefa de La Cruz Cordoba Garcia was christened on 15 Sep 1810 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
F vii. Ma. Guadalupe Josefa Cordoba Garcia was christened on 3 Feb 1812 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
82. Ramon Ynocencio Apodaca. Ramon married Maria Guadalupe Nino Ladron de Guevara on 6 Nov 1804 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
83. Maria Guadalupe Nino Ladron de Guevara.
They had the following children.
F i. Josefa Gorgoria Apodaca Guevara was christened on 12 Sep 1805 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
M ii. Jose Rosalio Apodaca Guebara was christened on 3 Sep 1807 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
+ 41 F iii. Ma. Ynosencia Apodaca Guebara was christened on 29 Dec 1809.
M iv. Jose Antonio Marcelo Apodaca Guebara was christened on 21 Feb 1812 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
M v. Jose Onofre Basilio Apodaca Guebara was christened on 26 Jun 1815 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
M vi. Jose Ramon Apodaca Guevara was christened in Mar 1820 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
M vii. Jose Julian Apodaca Guevara was christened on 14 Feb 1823 in Nuestra Senora De Guadalupe, Juarez, Chihuahua, Mexico.
I hope that this helps.
Jonathan
Rancho EL PAPELOTE EN JALISCO
I would like to know if anyone has any information regarding el RANCHO EL PAPELOTE IN JALISCO. My grandmother was from there. I don't know if that would belong to San Julian Jalisco or San Juan de Los Lagos Jalisco. My grandmother Camila Estrada was from that area. I can't seem to find anything on the web regarding this rancheria. Can anyone help?
Gracias,
Nelida Vazquez Estrada
Rancho EL PAPELOTE EN JALISCO
go here: http://biblio2.colmex.mx/bibdig/dicc_cubas/base3.htm
and under p and then Papelote it says:
"Rancho de la Municipalidad de San Juan de los Lagos, segundo canton,
estado de Jalisco. Otro de la municipalidad de Union."
joseph
Nelida1962 wrote:
>I would like to know if anyone has any information regarding el RANCHO EL PAPELOTE IN JALISCO. My grandmother was from there. I don't know if that would belong to San Julian Jalisco or San Juan de Los Lagos Jalisco. My grandmother Camila Estrada was from that area. I can't seem to find anything on the web regarding this rancheria. Can anyone help?
>
>Gracias,
>Nelida Vazquez Estrada
Rancho EL PAPELOTE EN JALISCO
Gracias Mr. Puentes for all your information. You have answered my question. That EL PAPELOTE belongs to San Juan de Los Lagos Jalisco not San Julian.
Muchas Gracias,
Nelida Vazquez Estrada
Joseph Puentes wrote:
go here: http://biblio2.colmex.mx/bibdig/dicc_cubas/base3.htm
and under p and then Papelote it says:
"Rancho de la Municipalidad de San Juan de los Lagos, segundo canton,
estado de Jalisco. Otro de la municipalidad de Union."
joseph
Nelida1962 wrote:
>I would like to know if anyone has any information regarding el RANCHO EL PAPELOTE IN JALISCO. My grandmother was from there. I don't know if that would belong to San Julian Jalisco or San Juan de Los Lagos Jalisco. My grandmother Camila Estrada was from that area. I can't seem to find anything on the web regarding this rancheria. Can anyone help?
>
>Gracias,
>Nelida Vazquez Estrada
(no subject)
Hello, My name is George Godoy, My ancestors were from Tlaltenango,Zacatecas and Tepechiltan, Zacatecas. This is my Linage Franco Godoy m. Rosamaria de Llamas, Agustine Godoy m. Maria Anttonia De La O, Casimiro Celedonio m. Ana de luna,Mathiana ynigues,and Petra Correa, Jose Crecencio Godoy m. Maria Lugarda Nava,Leocadia Cobarrubias. Jose Epitacio Godoy m.Josefa Marquez, Cristobal Godoy m. Maria Jesus Herrera, Catarina Godoy, Dorotea Sanchez. Juan Nepamuceno Godoy m. Petra Martinez,Florentina Agredano in Tepic,Nayarit.My Father Albino Godoy m. Maria Jesus Urias Monreal a Decendant of Presido of Tucson Arizona settlers.
For George, mi primo re: los Godoy
George:
You and I are primos. I am a direct descendant of Francisco Godoy, Maria de la Rosa Llamas and their son Agustin Godoy. I lose your lineage there. Are you saying that Agustin and Maria Antonia de la O had a son named Casimiro Celedonio? I did not have him as one of their children.
http://www.ramosfamily.org/nextgen/getperson.php?personID=I1281
I have a suspsicion that Francisco Godoy is a descendant of Juan Carlos de Godoy, whose descendancy Susana Leniski has documented quite well (you can find it in her member's genealogy folder), but I have not been able to make the connection as I cannot find the marriage document or birth document for Francisco de Godoy.
Welcome to the group. There is a whole group of us with lines in Tlaltenango and Tepechitlan and I am sure we are all related.
(no subject)
Hello, I would like to introduce myself. My name is George Godoy I been researching the Godoys/Godoi of Zacatecas so far I'm down to my nineth Gen. GreatGrandfather Nicolas Godoy his son Franco married Maria Rosa de LLamas in 1704, the family settle in Rancho de la LLamas in Tlaltenango,Zacatecas they are listed in the Census of Tlaltenango of 1754.
George
(no subject)
Do you have an Agustina in your de Llamas tree? Marge:)
On Nov 3, 2006, at 6:29 PM, godoi1m@netzero.net wrote:
> Hello, I would like to introduce myself. My name is George Godoy I
> been researching the Godoys/Godoi of Zacatecas so far I'm down to my
> nineth Gen. GreatGrandfather Nicolas Godoy his son Franco married
> Maria Rosa de LLamas in 1704, the family settle in Rancho de la LLamas
> in Tlaltenango,Zacatecas they are listed in the Census of Tlaltenango
> of 1754.
>
> George
Possible Connection - Finally!?!??!
George, I emailed you my genealogical report for my Godoy/Llamas line....is there a connection there? I haven't researched this line past 1746...my Godoy/Llamas are, too, in Tlaltenango de Sanchez Roman, in Zacatecas. I go up as far as Josseph Godoy married to Maria Magdalena de Llamas who had Maria Salvadora Godoy in 1756 and Maria Rita Godoy in 1746. Maria Salvadora married Francisco Salvador Bergara and that's the last of the line because the rest of my family branches out to Bergara's and then to Avila's and then to Correa's......let me know!
Peggy Delgado
Possible Connection - Finally!?!??!
George, I emailed you my genealogical report for my Godoy/Llamas line....is there a connection there? I haven't researched this line past 1746...my Godoy/Llamas are, too, in Tlaltenango de Sanchez Roman, in Zacatecas. I go up as far as Josseph Godoy married to Maria Magdalena de Llamas who had Maria Salvadora Godoy in 1756 and Maria Rita Godoy in 1746. Maria Salvadora married Francisco Salvador Bergara and that's the last of the line because the rest of my family branches out to Bergara's and then to Avila's and then to Correa's......let me know!
Peggy Delgado
(no subject)
Hello,
My Name is Denise Lovato-Duran I am researching the Lobato's who are from Sombrete, Zacatacas. I recently had my brother do his DNA and we turned out Halogroup Q-3 it also matched a Tafoya whose roots go back to Michoacan. I think my Indian ancestor came to Sombrete and was baptized a Lobato. The first Lobato's that came to New Mexico were Bartolome Lobato and his brother Matias I am possibly the descentant of Matias Lobato.
Thank You
Denise Lovato-Duran
Fw: (no subject)
----- Original Message -----
From: DENISE LOVATO-DURAN
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 7:52 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
Hello,
My Name is Denise Lovato-Duran I am researching the Lobato's who are from Sombrete, Zacatacas. I recently had my brother do his DNA and we turned out Halogroup Q-3 it also matched a Tafoya whose roots go back to Michoacan. I think my Indian ancestor came to Sombrete and was baptized a Lobato. The first Lobato's that came to New Mexico were Bartolome Lobato and his brother Matias I am possibly the descentant of Matias Lobato.
Thank You
Denise Lovato-Duran
(no subject)
Hola a todos:
Soy nuevo en este grupo y estoy interesado en genealogía principalmente de
Zacatecas. Mis abuelos paternos y la mayor parte de mis ancestros provienen
de Jerez, con ramas que vienen de Monte Escobedo, Tlaltenango, Fresnillo,
Colotlán, etc.
Cuento con bastante información sobre familias de Jerez y me pongo a su
disposición.
Saludos,
Héctor Félix Aizcorbe
(no subject)
Bienvenido, Hector,
Mis ancestros eran Felix de Arellano y Felix de Tinajero de Tepetongo y Salitrillo. Mis ancestros de apellido Olague eran de Jerez y Tepetongo. Tambien tengo Suriano, Quijas, Lucio, Escovedo, Aro, Flores, Munoz, Campos, Salazar, Miranda. Puedes ver mi arbol genealogico en este website.
Emilie Garcia
Port Orchard, WA --
----- Original Message -----
From: Hector Felix Aizcorbe
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Sunday, March 04, 2007 8:34 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
Hola a todos:
Soy nuevo en este grupo y estoy interesado en genealogía principalmente de
Zacatecas. Mis abuelos paternos y la mayor parte de mis ancestros provienen
de Jerez, con ramas que vienen de Monte Escobedo, Tlaltenango, Fresnillo,
Colotlán, etc.
Cuento con bastante información sobre familias de Jerez y me pongo a su
disposición.
Saludos,
Héctor Félix Aizcorbe
(no subject)
Hola Emilie:
Perdón por una respuesta tan tardía, pero he estado en cambio de trabajo muy
ocupado. Yo tengo entre mis ancestros muchos de los apellidos que mencionas,
y, en algunos casos, he avanzado mucho. Mi árbil genealógico lo tengo armado
en hojas de Excel, ya que a mi me facilita mas la consulta. Si te interesa
te lo puedo enviar, tengo un file por mi abuelo paterno y otro por mi abuela
paterna. Hoy he visitado el tuyo, pero a pesar de que muchos apellidos
coinciden, hasta ahora no aparece ninguno de mis ancestros.
Saludos y quedo a tus órdenes,
Héctor
>From: "Emilie Garcia"
>Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
>To:
>Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2007 04:01:57 -0800
>
>Bienvenido, Hector,
>
>Mis ancestros eran Felix de Arellano y Felix de Tinajero de Tepetongo y
>Salitrillo. Mis ancestros de apellido Olague eran de Jerez y Tepetongo.
>Tambien tengo Suriano, Quijas, Lucio, Escovedo, Aro, Flores, Munoz, Campos,
>Salazar, Miranda. Puedes ver mi arbol genealogico en este website.
>
>Emilie Garcia
>Port Orchard, WA --
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Hector Felix Aizcorbe
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Sent: Sunday, March 04, 2007 8:34 PM
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)
>
>
> Hola a todos:
>
> Soy nuevo en este grupo y estoy interesado en genealogía principalmente
>de
> Zacatecas. Mis abuelos paternos y la mayor parte de mis ancestros
>provienen
> de Jerez, con ramas que vienen de Monte Escobedo, Tlaltenango,
>Fresnillo,
> Colotlán, etc.
>
> Cuento con bastante información sobre familias de Jerez y me pongo a su
> disposición.
>
> Saludos,
> Héctor Félix Aizcorbe
>
>
> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
>
> To post, send email to:
> research(at)nuestrosranchos.org
>
> To change your subscription, log on to:
> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
(no subject)
This is the only info that I have on my family in AGUASCALIENTES:
FRANCISCA RODRIGUEZ b 10/4/1880 in LA DURNAMILLA, AGUASCALIENTES, MX
father: JOSE RODRIGUZ
mother: APOLONIA SERNA
spouse(1): VIDAL SERNA
spouse (2): MARTIN (MARTINIANO) SERNA
children of VIDAL SERNA and FRANCISCA RODRIGUEZ:
MARCOS RODRIGUEZ SERNA b abt 1902 in CALVILLO, AGUASCALIENTES, MX d DELANO,
KERN, CALIFORNIA, USA
JUAN RODRIGUEZ SERNA b abt 1901 in CALVILLO, AGUASCALIENTES, MX
ROSENDO RODRIGUEZ SERNA b abt 1904 in CALVILLO, AGUASCALIENTES, MX d abt 1953
in CUTLER, TULARE, CALIFORNIA, USA
CASIMIRO RODRIGUEZ SERNA: b 3/4/1909 in CALVILLO, AGUASCALIENTES, MX d
2/15/2002 in CUTLER, TULARE, CALIFORNIA, USA This is my grandfather
_http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/node/16087_
(http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/node/16087)
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
(no subject)
Good Evening Group, I have the opportunity to join friends on a trip to Aguascalientes and Zacatecas this Semana Santa. In my efforts to locate information on my mother, Enedina Onate's family, I've been through several LDS films following leads with no success. It appears that most of my oral history evades documentation. The only fact I have to work from is that my great-grandfather, Rosalio Onate, originally from Villa Garcia, Zac.(based on border crossing records) is entombed in an Aguascalientes, Agua. church. At 13, I was taken to see it, but at the time I wasn't interested and don't know the name of the church! I'd like to take this is my opportunity to find information on Rosalio and immediate family from the church. I've checked film 0299882 Aguascalientes deaths from 1918-1961 with no luck. How do you suggest I narrow down the possibilities and locate the church? I would like to arrive with some information to go on as my time will be limited. Any help on researching in Mexico and visiting in general would be greatly appreciated. Thanks so much, Alice BB
--- arturo.ramos2@gmail.com wrote:
From: arturoramos
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Lopez and Viramontes in Jalpa Zacatecas
Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 09:10:13 -0800 (PST)
Veronica:
Welcome to the group. I am sure you will find plenty of people here willing to help.
As far as Jalpa records, you are correct in that they are skimpy. There appears to have been loss of most of the records probably in a war or a fire. If you do a search on the site, there are members who have been able to research genealogy and microhistory nevertheless.
I think given the approximate dates of the ancestors for whom you have details, you should be able to find some records. Jalpa does not appear to be indexed (given the late years and paucity of the records). So that means you will basically have to look through the films.
Your great-grandparents appear to have been born around 1880 and probably married around 1900 so their baptisms might not be in the church records, but your grandparents likely are. Many baptism records post-1820 or so and nearly all civil registry records include grandparents' names so your grandparents' baptisms/birth registry will list your great-grandparents and great-great grandparents' names.
Also your great grandparents' marriage records are likely in the informacion matrimonial films from Jalpa and those will likewise list your great-great-grandparents' names. In fact, because the informacion matrimonial goes back to 1864, you should be able to find even your great-great-grandparents' marriages from which you can get their parents' names. Then there is a 36 year gap which you may or may not be able to overcome but you can cross that bridge when you get to it... seems like you have plenty to work with for now.
From http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library/FHLC/frameset_fhlc.asp
JALPA CHURCH RECORDS
Bautismos 1909-1919 VAULT INTL Film 1158671
Confirmaciones 1880-1900 FHL INTL Film 1158672 Item 1
Información matrimonial 1864-1875 FHL INTL Film 1511832 Items 3-4
Información matrimonial 1874-1897 VAULT INTL Film 1511824
Información matrimonial 1898-1904 VAULT INTL Film 1511825
Información matrimonial 1905-1923 VAULT INTL Film 1511833
Información matrimonial 1923-1924 FHL INTL Film 1506870 Item 1
Información matrimonial 1944 FHL INTL Film 1158673 Item 3
Matrimonios 1827-1838, 1913-1918 FHL INTL Film 1158672 Items 2-4
Matrimonios 1917-1920 FHL INTL Film 1158673 Items 1-2
Defunciones 1814-1917 FHL INTL Film 1158673 Items 4-5
JALPA CIVIL REGISTRY
Nacimientos 1896-1898 VAULT INTL Film 773877
Nacimientos 1899-1902 VAULT INTL Film 773878
Nacimientos 1903-1905 VAULT INTL Film 773879
Nacimientos 1906-1909 VAULT INTL Film 773880
Rosalio Oñate in the phone book? For Alice B. B.
When you are there check the phone book, look for Oñate and make phone calls regarding your ggrandpa, identify yourself inmediatly and than make your request clearly, cause of phone calls that bad people make asking for monetary help, nowadays people hesitate to give up info, so one better give up info first. Look for anyone with similar names such any Rosalio, as it is usual to name children arter relatives. Look in the surrounding towns phone books also, make a list first so you can carry it back in case time is not enough. That is an idea, good luck. Maybe a name will ring off the memory afterwards.
Do you have and old relative close? Talk about your trip, comment about names and related places. Maybe it will ring the bell.
---------------------------------
¡Capacidad ilimitada de almacenamiento en tu correo!
No te preocupes más por el espacio de tu cuenta con Correo Yahoo!:
http://correo.yahoo.com.mx/
(no subject)
Hi Daniel, Were you able to locate and access the capital city of Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes through the website you sent for 1930 Mexico census? The folks at my FHC couldn't locate through that site. It sure would help if I knew that someone could locate and access it. Thanks, Alice BB
_________________________________________________________________
Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live.
http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGHM_Wave2_sharelife_01…
(no subject)
Hello Everyone,
My name is Cindy Gutierrez and I am researching my father Antonio's family. He was born in Jalisco in a small town called Acatic. He was born on his father's Rancho El Sauz. The family names I am researching are Gutierrez(my grandmother Josephinas family name) and De La Torre (my grandfather Antonios family name). Included are De Moron, Becerra, and a few others that I am still trying to get. My Grandmothers family had a Rancho near Tepa, I think, my dad is kind of fuzzy on some things, but I will get all the information I can. Most of my fathers family is here now, although they live part of the year in Acatic. I have been to Mexico many times to see family and take pictures of the Rancho before they sold it. I would love to know more about my family and possibly connect with cousins here in California and elsewhere. Unfortunately I no longer am able to speak Spanish so that has limited my ability to get information. I am very by the possibilites of
this website.
Cindy Gutierrez
(no subject)
Hi Cindy I have some Gutierrez and De la Torre in my family too. I guess info posted on these surnames will be usful for both of us. I submited a small file, please seeif you can access it, it may be useful for you.
Gabriela> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 03:25:42 -0700> From: cjg63@sbcglobal.net> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)> > Hello Everyone,> > My name is Cindy Gutierrez and I am researching my father Antonio's family. He was born in Jalisco in a small town called Acatic. He was born on his father's Rancho El Sauz. The family names I am researching are Gutierrez(my grandmother Josephinas family name) and De La Torre (my grandfather Antonios family name). Included are De Moron, Becerra, and a few others that I am still trying to get. My Grandmothers family had a Rancho near Tepa, I think, my dad is kind of fuzzy on some things, but I will get all the information I can. Most of my fathers family is here now, although they live part of the year in Acatic. I have been to Mexico many times to see family and take pictures of the Rancho before they sold it. I would love to know more about my family and possibly connect with cousins here in California an
d elsewhere. Unfortunately I no longer am able to speak Spanish so that has limited my ability to get information. I am very by the possibilites of> this website. > > Cindy Gutierrez> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List> > To post, send email to:> research(at)nuestrosranchos.org> > To change your subscription, log on to:> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
_________________________________________________________________
More immediate than e-mail? Get instant access with Windows Live Messenger.
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Gutierrez y de La Torre
Hola Ladies ,I too have Gutierrez and de La Torre lines. The Gutierrez line hangs out in the region of Los Altos -Jalostotitlan,San Miguel el Alto and San Julian . Jalos lies near Tepatitlan. I have an ancestor Clemente de La Torre Ledesma (which are two names put together some time back) was from Tepatitlan and his offspring which some stayed with de La Torre.
Ronnie Reynoso > From: gsoa@hotmail.com> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 11:30:21 -0500> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)> > > Hi Cindy I have some Gutierrez and De la Torre in my family too. I guess info posted on these surnames will be usful for both of us. I submited a small file, please seeif you can access it, it may be useful for you.> Gabriela> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 03:25:42 -0700> From: cjg63@sbcglobal.net> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)> > Hello Everyone,> > My name is Cindy Gutierrez and I am researching my father Antonio's family. He was born in Jalisco in a small town called Acatic. He was born on his father's Rancho El Sauz. The family names I am researching are Gutierrez(my grandmother Josephinas family name) and De La Torre (my grandfather Antonios family name). Included are De Moron, Becerra, and a few others that I am still trying to get. My Grandmothers family had a Rancho near
Tepa, I think, my dad is kind of fuzzy on some things, but I will get all the information I can. Most of my fathers family is here now, although they live part of the year in Acatic. I have been to Mexico many times to see family and take pictures of the Rancho before they sold it. I would love to know more about my family and possibly connect with cousins here in California an> d elsewhere. Unfortunately I no longer am able to speak Spanish so that has limited my ability to get information. I am very by the possibilites of> this website. > > Cindy Gutierrez> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List> > To post, send email to:> research(at)nuestrosranchos.org> > To change your subscription, log on to:> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org> _________________________________________________________________> More immediate than e-mail? Get instant access with Windows Live Messenger.> http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TA
GLM_WL_Refresh_instantaccess_042008> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List> > To post, send email to:> research(at)nuestrosranchos.org> > To change your subscription, log on to:> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
Gutierrez y de La Torre
Ronnie,
I would be interested in any information concerning the De La Torre line
from Jalostotitlan. My great Grandfather was Sisto De La Torre and have
been unable to find any information about him to get things started.
J. Felix De La Torre
Sacramento
-----Original Message-----
From: research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
[mailto:research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org] On Behalf Of Ronald
Reynoso
Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 12:50 PM
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Gutierrez y de La Torre
Hola Ladies ,I too have Gutierrez and de La Torre lines. The Gutierrez
line hangs out in the region of Los Altos -Jalostotitlan,San Miguel el
Alto and San Julian . Jalos lies near Tepatitlan. I have an ancestor
Clemente de La Torre Ledesma (which are two names put together some time
back) was from Tepatitlan and his offspring which some stayed with de La
Torre.
Ronnie Reynoso > From: gsoa@hotmail.com> To:
research@nuestrosranchos.org> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 11:30:21 -0500>
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)> > > Hi Cindy I have some
Gutierrez and De la Torre in my family too. I guess info posted on these
surnames will be usful for both of us. I submited a small file, please
seeif you can access it, it may be useful for you.> Gabriela> Date: Tue,
15 Apr 2008 03:25:42 -0700> From: cjg63@sbcglobal.net> To:
research@nuestrosranchos.org> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)>
> Hello Everyone,> > My name is Cindy Gutierrez and I am researching my
father Antonio's family. He was born in Jalisco in a small town called
Acatic. He was born on his father's Rancho El Sauz. The family names I
am researching are Gutierrez(my grandmother Josephinas family name) and
De La Torre (my grandfather Antonios family name). Included are De
Moron, Becerra, and a few others that I am still trying to get. My
Grandmothers family had a Rancho near
Tepa, I think, my dad is kind of fuzzy on some things, but I will get
all the information I can. Most of my fathers family is here now,
although they live part of the year in Acatic. I have been to Mexico
many times to see family and take pictures of the Rancho before they
sold it. I would love to know more about my family and possibly connect
with cousins here in California an> d elsewhere. Unfortunately I no
longer am able to speak Spanish so that has limited my ability to get
information. I am very by the possibilites of> this website. > > Cindy
Gutierrez> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > Nuestros Ranchos
Research Mailing List> > To post, send email to:>
research(at)nuestrosranchos.org> > To change your subscription, log on
to:> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org>
_________________________________________________________________> More
immediate than e-mail? Get instant access with Windows Live Messenger.>
http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TA
GLM_WL_Refresh_instantaccess_042008> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
Gutierrez y de La Torre
Felix, who is Sisto married to and which son do do descend from. I may have your answers?
----- Original Message -----
From: Felix De La Torre
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2008 8:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Gutierrez y de La Torre
Ronnie,
I would be interested in any information concerning the De La Torre line
from Jalostotitlan. My great Grandfather was Sisto De La Torre and have
been unable to find any information about him to get things started.
J. Felix De La Torre
Sacramento
-----Original Message-----
From: research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
[mailto:research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org] On Behalf Of Ronald
Reynoso
Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 12:50 PM
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Gutierrez y de La Torre
Hola Ladies ,I too have Gutierrez and de La Torre lines. The Gutierrez> To:> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 11:30:21 -0500>> To:> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)>
line hangs out in the region of Los Altos -Jalostotitlan,San Miguel el
Alto and San Julian . Jalos lies near Tepatitlan. I have an ancestor
Clemente de La Torre Ledesma (which are two names put together some time
back) was from Tepatitlan and his offspring which some stayed with de La
Torre.
Ronnie Reynoso > From: gsoa@hotmail.com
research@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] (no subject)> > > Hi Cindy I have some
Gutierrez and De la Torre in my family too. I guess info posted on these
surnames will be usful for both of us. I submited a small file, please
seeif you can access it, it may be useful for you.> Gabriela> Date: Tue,
15 Apr 2008 03:25:42 -0700> From: cjg63@sbcglobal.net
research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Hello Everyone,> > My name is Cindy Gutierrez and I am researching my
father Antonio's family. He was born in Jalisco in a small town called
Acatic. He was born on his father's Rancho El Sauz. The family names I
am researching are Gutierrez(my grandmother Josephinas family name) and
De La Torre (my grandfather Antonios family name). Included are De
Moron, Becerra, and a few others that I am still trying to get. My
Grandmothers family had a Rancho near
Tepa, I think, my dad is kind of fuzzy on some things, but I will get
all the information I can. Most of my fathers family is here now,
although they live part of the year in Acatic. I have been to Mexico
many times to see family and take pictures of the Rancho before they
sold it. I would love to know more about my family and possibly connect
with cousins here in California an> d elsewhere. Unfortunately I no
longer am able to speak Spanish so that has limited my ability to get
information. I am very by the possibilites of> this website. > > Cindy
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